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Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 1:28 pm
by Freddo3000
Hello, I have a bit of an idea for steel production revolving around coal coke and blast furnaces.

Now I read that the developers quite liked modded minecraft, so if they've played around with Railcraft, they'll probably remember some of this.
Coke Ovens
Blast Furnaces
Creosote Oil
Late game

TL;DR: Make coke ovens to refine coal to coal coke, use creosote side product from coke oven to produce Blast Furnaces, use coal coke to fuel blast furnaces and make steel. :)

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:29 pm
by MalcolmCooks
I think this is a really well thought-out suggestion, and I quite like it. my only criticism is that the speed of processing steel and coke you suggest seems too high to make mass-production easy.
However, I think, it might be more suitable for being a game mod than something in vanilla. The Factorio devs like to stick to some principles when thinking about adding new features. Generally they feel it is better to have a lower number of objects in the game that are multi-purpose as much as possible. This is probably why furnaces in the game currently smelt all kinds of ore.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 8:34 pm
by ske
I feel that steel processing is too easy in the game as it is right now. In my opinion it should eat less iron but take longer - especially with the early game ovens the steel recipe should really take a long time. Also, making steel requires coal.

The recipe is: (see: https://wiki.factorio.com/index.php?title=Steel_Plate )
5 iron plates, 17.5 seconds => 1 steel

The recipe should be like:
2 iron plates + 1 coal, 40 seconds => 1 steel,

In the electric ovens it should be like:
20 iron plates + 1 coal, 40 seconds = 10 steel.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:01 pm
by MalcolmCooks
Steel production doesn't require raw coal, it requires coke, which is processed from coal or oil. If the recipe in game was changed to reflect this, you would need to add coke processing which would probably be done simply by "smelting" coal in a furnace.
However, at the point of early steel production you would most likely be "smelting" coal in a coal-burning furnace, which seems a little dubious. In actuality, coke is produced from coal in the same kind of process that produces charcoal, as a controlled burning reaction with limited oxygen. So why not say that this process happens inside steel-producing furnaces? If wood fuel, it produces charcoal, if coal, it produces coke, as an internal process while smelting steel. Then we have no change in the recipe at all.
As for solid fuel, coke can also be produced from oil, so the solid fuel in game is probably actually already coke. Now there are also electric furnaces, which don't burn fuel but can still produce steel. Since they require plastic (advanced circuit), to get electric furnace you already have the capacity to produce solid fuel, so the only change needed would be to add solid fuel to the recipe for making steel, but only in electric furnaces. In fact, steel can be made without coke in real-life electric furnaces. Reason? Steel contains very little carbon. Coke is needed not because of the need to add carbon to the iron, but because of the need to remove other impurities.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:44 pm
by Yinan
I don't see why it should be complicated in the vanilla game.
If you want to have it more coomplicated, make it in a mod. I seriously don't understand all those people that use mods that complicate nearly all processes by adding X amount of intermediate steps in between.
Another problem I see is that it's easier to add a few steps then to remove some steps.

All in all, I think this should be part of a mod, not of the base game.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 10:24 pm
by ssilk
Some similar ideas:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=535&hilit=steel+blast Some ideas
viewtopic.php?f=66&t=316&hilit=steel+blast Advanced Metal Smelting
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4638&&hilit=steel+production 17+ IDEAS to make FACTORIO an even more AWESOME game!

But there are a lot more, around metal in general.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:46 am
by bobingabout
In my opinion, this is something that would be more likely to happen as a mod, rather than a base game addition.

Re: Improved steel production

Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:30 pm
by Arch666Angel
The only real difference between (cast)iron (<0,1% C and >2,% C) and steel (0,1%<C<2%) is the amount of carbon in it. And the smelting process heavily depends on the raw material, if you make iron from ores it is necessary to add different other element to get the chemical reactions to split of the impurities (the process were a blast furnace is most likely to be used), but most steel and iron in our time actually comes from recycling in other words the use of already relatively pure scarp iron (which can be done in a arc and/or magnetic induction furnace).