Transport Belt Overhaul

[Cerus]

I dislike the current transport belt system, I was thinking of ways to freshen up the concept while correcting what I perceive as inconsistencies in the way the belt system works compared to the other systems in Factorio.

I specifically dislike that the belts are self-powered, almost every other automated system requires a power source of some kind; but I also dislike the idea of needing to cover every last inch of transport belt with power line coverage.

My suggestion would be to replace the tiers of transport belts with a single belt type, but then move the tier concept over to a new device that powers the belt, like a "belt motor". The belt motors could be of different types (think along the lines of the existing burner/electric structures) and offer different ranges (so you could have a burner motor, a long distance motor, a high speed motor, etc.) and accept modules and the like. I figure the distance would be calculated in a manner similar to that of hot water being pumped through steam engines. The motor itself could either resemble a belt tile, or sit parallel to the belt. For the sake of not overcomplicating it, belts would still have their own directions, they'd only require adjacency within the distance limit to receive power, assume some clever gearing.

The intended effects:

• The automated belts would now have the same behaviors and requirements as all the other automated systems.
• The belt upgrade process is now centralized to a handful of motors instead of tile by tile in your belt system.
• Trains become slightly more attractive for efficient long distance cargo hauling.

[applemachine]

I had a similar problem with the belts. They seem to do the most work and require no energy to move. Still I'm glad I don't have to power belts over long distances. I'm willing to concede some realism in order to keep the game fun. I do, however, see the push towards trains if belts required power.

With some kind of accumulator upgrade and a more robust energy system in the game, powering belts would be more viable. Whether this is through some kind of belt motor system or through the current system + power, I would be satisfied.

[n9103]

Personally, I think this would kill the enjoyment of early game development, considering the amount of time it can take to go from the default 8 iron plates into power production, and that's with the current powerless belts. (and it feels grind-like most of the time after the 3rd or fourth time you've done it.)
I'm rather disinclined to even imagine the grind that this would create. (even burner motor belts would still drag the process out)

If anything, we should be streamlining the initial development, helping both experienced players and newbies alike.

About the only way I'd say this could be a viable idea, is if it were applied only towards the higher tiers of belts.

[ssilk]

- I don't think that this would bring it as game forward. Especially the beginning would be harder, slower, needs more effort and more complexity with the same result.
- if belts need power, then the pump should need it, too. I think that has already been discussed.
- maybe later in the game "ultra belts" are introduced and I doesn't have anything against them to use power.
- it's a game, needs not to be realistic.

[wrtlprnft]

Personally, I think this would kill the enjoyment of early game development, considering the amount of time it can take to go from the default 8 iron plates into power production, and that's with the current powerless belts. (and it feels grind-like most of the time after the 3rd or fourth time you've done it.)

Hmm, I don't even use transport belts until I have electric power, as they would require me to babysit more burner inserters… Instead, I just have burner mining drills directly insert ore into furnaces (they are close match in their operating speeds, so it's not even a waste), and a cascade of drills to mine coal into a chest.

My first transport belt is always the one that will feed coal to the boilers, and if I only had to craft a single long-distance, extremely-low-speed belt motor, it would not be that big a deal for me.

[SilverWarior]

To be honest I also dislike that currently belts have no need for any kind of power. Therefore I like this suggestion.

As for those of you who are scared that implementing this idea would make game start even more difficult and much slower I have an idea of how to solve this.
The main problem of this all is that Factorio jumps right into industrialization without taking into account any pre-industrialization techonologies. So adding some pre-industrialization technologies would save that problem. For instance:
Implementing windmils to power the Belt motors, or water pumps would allow theese to be powered without the need of electricity or coal (burner versions).
Naturally since the wind isn't always blowing with same power such system would have tendancy for expiriencing speed fuctuations. This would kinda drive player into replacing this system with better one later on but it could be good for decent start.

And when you take into account that developers plans to change the creeper behavior so that their attacs would be affected by the amount of polution you generate such system would be ideal for starting up as it won't attract crepers too fast.

[3LollipopZ]

To me this game is all about automation and not micro management; I do not want to see conveyors, at least slow conveyors, requiring power as it would mean having to manually fill buildings with Coal.

I think we should deff have more power options early game (wind, etc.), but powered conveyors are just another pain to stretch out early game.
Perhaps a huge battery from your ship could power things until you had self sustainable power up and running (Coal, Wind, Solar, Nuclear, etc.).

I do want to see belts carry power rather than running lines alongside them (that I run into in my car).