Factorio Forums

TL;DR

Make it possible to use higher quality components to create rocket parts

What?

The TL;DR is quite sufficient I think. By using quality modules in all miners (especially on Fulgora) I'm creating a lot of quality Solid Fuel. My Fulgora base is currently bottlenecked in sending rockets due to not having enough Rocket Fuel, due to being out of Normal Solid Fuel. Meanwhile I hundreds of thousands of solid fuel of different qualities, that I'd love to turn into rocket fuel to keep sending stuff to orbit. Perhaps we could choose to create Rocket Parts of higher quality, requiring the blue circuit, low density structure and rocket fuel to be of the same quality and have an uncommon Rocket Part provide 3% rocket completion, a rare Rocket part 4%, epic 5% and legendary 7%? Or something similar. Just let quality parts also be of use in sending rockets to space.

Why?

Quality is AFAIK supposed to be a straight up improvement. In this case, Rocket production can be throttlenecked due to running out of normal quality components while having an excess of higher quality components.

+1 This is very annoying on Fulgora

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 08, 2024 12:09 pm

My Fulgora base is currently bottlenecked in sending rockets due to not having enough Rocket Fuel, due to being out of Normal Solid Fuel.

You must have recycled a TON of non-quality solid fuel.

Even with four legendary modules each in your drill and recycler, over 56% of the recycled scrap outputs will be non-quality. That means you can never have more quality solid fuel on hand than the total amount of non-quality you've gotten.

And you have 96k EPIC, which means you've recycled a stupendous amount of solid fuel. Just rolling up from rare to epic is going to take four trips through the recycler on average, and the chance to survive that many is quite low. Unless you've launched zillion rockets, I don't see how you can be out without having recycled a lot of it.

You recycled it all, didn't you?

Tinyboss wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 08, 2024 10:27 pm

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 08, 2024 12:09 pm

My Fulgora base is currently bottlenecked in sending rockets due to not having enough Rocket Fuel, due to being out of Normal Solid Fuel.

You must have recycled a TON of non-quality solid fuel.

Even with four legendary modules each in your drill and recycler, over 56% of the recycled scrap outputs will be non-quality. That means you can never have more quality solid fuel on hand than the total amount of non-quality you've gotten.

And you have 96k EPIC, which means you've recycled a stupendous amount of solid fuel. Just rolling up from rare to epic is going to take four trips through the recycler on average, and the chance to survive that many is quite low. Unless you've launched zillion rockets, I don't see how you can be out without having recycled a lot of it.

You recycled it all, didn't you?

No, I didn't. I have my base set up as a kind of manifold, which means that ONLY overflow is "upcycled". So all the epic solid fuel is produced either directly from scrap, or from overflow uncommon or rare solid fuel. I do not recycle ANY normal solid fuel, since their buffers obviously don't overflow due to being used for rocket fuel production.

Related :

Allow higher quality rocket fuel for rocket silo recipe
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=117243

Allow rocket silos to take a much wider variety of fuels to build rocket parts
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=120210

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 1:32 pm

No, I didn't. I have my base set up as a kind of manifold, which means that ONLY overflow is "upcycled". So all the epic solid fuel is produced either directly from scrap, or from overflow uncommon or rare solid fuel. I do not recycle ANY normal solid fuel, since their buffers obviously don't overflow due to being used for rocket fuel production.

Mathematically there's no way you can have that much epic solid fuel without having mined many, many times more common. It's not possible, not even close, not even with full legendary Q3 modules everywhere.

train with nuclear rocket fuel soon ?

Tinyboss wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 3:06 pm

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 1:32 pm

No, I didn't. I have my base set up as a kind of manifold, which means that ONLY overflow is "upcycled". So all the epic solid fuel is produced either directly from scrap, or from overflow uncommon or rare solid fuel. I do not recycle ANY normal solid fuel, since their buffers obviously don't overflow due to being used for rocket fuel production.

Mathematically there's no way you can have that much epic solid fuel without having mined many, many times more common. It's not possible, not even close, not even with full legendary Q3 modules everywhere.

Of course I have mined many times more common. Check the screenshots for my Fulgora production. My issue is simply as stated - I'm using all my normal solid fuel while having no use for all the quality solid fuel I'm accumulating. Pretty much most other quality resources I'm getting on Fulgora at least have other uses. I'd be happy just to be able to downgrade > normal solid fuel to =normal solid fuel to at least have some use of it.

Related :

Allow Quality Downgrade
(With a working mod inside.)

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 7:30 pm

Of course I have mined many times more common. Check the screenshots for my Fulgora production. My issue is simply as stated - I'm using all my normal solid fuel while having no use for all the quality solid fuel I'm accumulating. Pretty much most other quality resources I'm getting on Fulgora at least have other uses. I'd be happy just to be able to downgrade > normal solid fuel to =normal solid fuel to at least have some use of it.

I mean...recycling shows up on the consumption graph, too. I accept that you haven't (intentionally) recycled any, but that's about 20,000 launches worth!! 50 rocket fuel, times 10 solid fuel each, times 20k is 10M. If you've done that many, then surely you have the resources to expand your production and fix your throttling.

Can you show your all-time Fulgora rocket fuel, blue circuit, and LDS production?

I get that you just want *something* to use the quality ones for, and I understand that as a matter of principle. But I disagree that it's that big a deal, and it's definitely not to blame for throttling your launch rate.

Tinyboss wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 9:18 pm

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 7:30 pm

Of course I have mined many times more common. Check the screenshots for my Fulgora production. My issue is simply as stated - I'm using all my normal solid fuel while having no use for all the quality solid fuel I'm accumulating. Pretty much most other quality resources I'm getting on Fulgora at least have other uses. I'd be happy just to be able to downgrade > normal solid fuel to =normal solid fuel to at least have some use of it.

I mean...recycling shows up on the consumption graph, too. I accept that you haven't (intentionally) recycled any, but that's about 20,000 launches worth!! 50 rocket fuel, times 10 solid fuel each, times 20k is 10M. If you've done that many, then surely you have the resources to expand your production and fix your throttling.

Can you show your all-time Fulgora rocket fuel, blue circuit, and LDS production?

I get that you just want *something* to use the quality ones for, and I understand that as a matter of principle. But I disagree that it's that big a deal, and it's definitely not to blame for throttling your launch rate.

It was probably hyperbole that *no* normal solid fuel had been recycled, as my system recycles any whenever my buffers are full and I haven't always been sending rockets constantly. But yes, I've been launching quite a few rockets from Fulgora, as my base there is my main finished product factory. From some very quick calculations I've launched about 8k rockets from Fulgora. I currently have about 300k buffered quality solid fuel - which disregarding any productivity buffs would be enough rocket fuel to launch approximately 800 rockets, which would be 10% of my total rockets from Fulgora. That said, since I haven't had any use for solid fuel most of the quality fuel has been recycled. My consumption stats show that I have consumed about 5 million quality solid fuel, which would be enough to send 10k rockets which in fact is a very significant amount.

I have currently expanded my Fulgora base as much as I can (16 full green belts of scrap input), but as I have yet to go to Aquilo I don't have foundations and am thus unable to further expand the base. Obviously I have the means to go there etc, but that's not the point of this post. It's the fact that I have wasted millions of solid fuel that could have been put to use. Which is why I think my original suggestion is very reasonable

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 9:54 pm

I've launched about 8k rockets from Fulgora.

Okay, that's impressive!

FoolishBalloon wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 9:54 pm

I have currently expanded my Fulgora base as much as I can (16 full green belts of scrap input), but as I have yet to go to Aquilo I don't have foundations and am thus unable to further expand the base. Obviously I have the means to go there etc, but that's not the point of this post. It's the fact that I have wasted millions of solid fuel that could have been put to use. Which is why I think my original suggestion is very reasonable

Well...again, I understand the desire. But I think 8k rocket launches before Aquilo is enough of an outlier that we can say it's not interfering with the majority of players.

I just thought of this, but don't you have mech armor by now, and you can just fly out to another island and start a second base? That seems like not too inappropriately much of a hassle if you're launching on the order of ten thousand rockets!