[2.0.15] Biters expand beyond cliff

[Rahbek]

Biters can build a nest that grows to both sides of a cliff, circumventing their defensive function.
I did run into the same issue and forgot to take a screenshot, so I am sharing someone else's reddit post on the same issue. The picture is taken from there:
https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... _cheating/

Given how the new Terrain Generation and cliffs were teased in FF-401 to be a great defensive tool I found it odd how biters can simply build a nest that spans both sides. Even the engineer has no access to ladders to traverse cliffs...
It caused me to entirely ignore cliffs again for defensive purposes as they are not reliable. Which is quite a shame given the changes made me actually enable cliffs for my 2.0 playthrough so i had high hopes.
I was hoping that this is considered a bug/unintened behaviour and could get fixed

Additional Info: i started my currently playthrouh on 2.0.7 when encountering this behavior - running the latest stable release atm.
It happened a few times as well.

[Rseding91]

Thanks for the report. I don't consider this to be worth changing. Cliffs are not a guarantee of protection.

[Sharparam]

Cliffs are not a guarantee of protection.

So what about all that stuff about making cliffs more useful for defense in FFF-401?

[Rahbek]

Thanks for the report. I don't consider this to be worth changing. Cliffs are not a guarantee of protection.

Cliffs are not a guarantee of protection.

So what about all that stuff about making cliffs more useful for defense in FFF-401?

That's fine, I can live with that, but personally I agree with Sharparam here. I'll likely turn them off again in future playthroughs.
I definitely had a different expectations/hopes in regards to cliffs with the changes. This way they are really just an inconvenience and at best save you some wall pieces. Doesn't feel worth it to me to make up their inconvenience.
Not to mention ingame lore wise the engineer can build spaceships but can't even craft something basic like ladder to traverse these cliff. Yet biters can build their home across the boundry - just feels off.

[Jap2.0]

Cliffs are not a guarantee of protection.

So what about all that stuff about making cliffs more useful for defense in FFF-401?

More useful ≠ perfect

[Sharparam]

More useful ≠ perfect

Notice how I did not say perfect? As it stands, cliffs are no more "useful" than they were in 1.1 since you have to treat them as open space and litter them with turrets anyway. As mentioned above, all it does is save you from having to build some walls.

If you read the referenced FFF, it talks about how cliffs were not very useful in 1.1 because they had gaps that you had to defend, which implies 2.0 continuous cliffs would not have to be covered in turrets.

[Rahbek]

If you read the referenced FFF, it talks about how cliffs were not very useful in 1.1 because they had gaps that you had to defend, which implies 2.0 continuous cliffs would not have to be covered in turrets.

Thats how I interpreted it aswell, hence my dissapointement. For me at least they are not more useful now.
My defenses are blueprinted (its an automation game after all) - so cliffs require me to either create a custom solution (wasting time) or ignore cliffs again. And not having cliff explosions early makes me lean towards ignoring them (aka treating them like pre changes). Bit of a shame cause it looks cool when you connect your defenses to them but i couldn't care less about saving wall pieces.
Anyways I understand if it takes too much dev time to fix this or it's not part of how their (devs) vision for the game. Merely sharing my feedback as one player out of many (or one out of the group that seemed to interpret it similarly)

[ObviouslyN0tMe]

Disappointing, what are cliffs there for then if not protection?

[Rseding91]

Disappointing, what are cliffs there for then if not protection?

Decoration, gameplay interactions, later, exploding.