Factorio Forums

There's a phpBB extension that [adds markdown support to posts](https://www.phpbb.com/customise/db/extension/markdown/).

Just saying... would be *pretty sweet*.

**Especially** convenient for:

- Lists!
- Formatting!
- Code!
- And more!

Note
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Definitely _not_ being passive-aggressive here. Nope.

Only if it's 100% optional on a per user basis.

I absolutely do not like markdown. Not as powerful as phpbb with the added effect of changing the formatting on things that you may not have wanted it to change without the ability to escape.

FuryoftheStars wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 3:40 pm Only if it's 100% optional on a per user basis.

Definitely. The extension description says:

Can be used instead of or alongside text formatted with BBCode

And the way it works is it doesn't replace BBCode, but it enables Markdown parsing in addition. So if you were to post a mix in a single post, like:
Then it would work and parse both, and both sections would look the same.

+1 on that. Especially strange together with the fact that mods.factorio.com use Markdown.

JasonC wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 5:00 pm

FuryoftheStars wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 3:40 pm Only if it's 100% optional on a per user basis.

Definitely. The extension description says:

Can be used instead of or alongside text formatted with BBCode

And the way it works is it doesn't replace BBCode, but it enables Markdown parsing in addition.

I'm going to reiterate on the "only if it's 100% optional on a per user basis" here. I say that because that description is vague, and while I know there's the "Disable BBCode" option under the posting options, so presumably this may be the same for markdown, there are some things that I've become aware of recently that can only be done admin side for the entirety of the forum that would have expectantly been a per user setting, such as the number of posts displayed per page when viewing a thread. If this would be another such forum wide only "optional" feature, then I will absolutely rail against it being put in. (Yes, I dislike markdown that much. So on the note of the poster above mentioning the inconsistency with the mod portal, my preference would be to actually get rid of markdown on the mod portal and replace it with something else like BBCode or HTML tags (if the inconsistency is an issue for some).)

I love markdown. It's amazing for what it is meant for. It is not meant for forum posts though and I'm against having it as an option on the forums here as well. mods.factorio.com should also convert to BB code. Markdown doesn't have referencing quotes. If someone replies to me or I reply to someone else then the quotes don't ping which makes it very hard to keep track of who is quoted, who you are responding to and when you have a response from someone. It's also very painful trying to work with multilevel quotes unless you bring in something like Ace editor https://ace.c9.io/ so we can actually indent and de-indent quote levels with hotkeys and do similar multi-line edits. Markdown works fine when it is written in a code editor as documentation for code.

Also, if I don't want to use Markdown but everyone I'm quoting has a sloppy Markdown soup of quotes then that would be annoying.

Markdown is fine for mod descriptions though, it's what it is designed for, creating documents. It works in chat apps like Discord as well because you don't need to quote multiple people in one post in chat and you can "reply" to specific posts to make up for some weaknesses in Markdown. And the weaknesses you can't make up for you can ignore because it is a chat.

JasonC wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 5:00 pm

FuryoftheStars wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 3:40 pm Only if it's 100% optional on a per user basis.

Definitely. The extension description says:

Can be used instead of or alongside text formatted with BBCode

And the way it works is it doesn't replace BBCode, but it enables Markdown parsing in addition. So if you were to post a mix in a single post, like:

Code: Select all

[b]Example[/b]
# Some Other Heading

Then it would work and parse both, and both sections would look the same.

That is not acceptable to me. Look now you are saying that it wouldn't be optional, it would interpret all my messages as markdown regardless of if I consent to it or not. I'm not able to write *some characters* without Markdown ripping them off me and forcefully inserting its markup into my non-consenting post. If it just interprets it as both BBcode and Markdown then that is the opposite of optional. Optional would be just *writing things* and unless I tick in the box for each post to use Markdown then it just appears as I've written it. Or have a BBcode [markdown]# and this is a markdown section of my post[/markdown] would be acceptable for things that aren't quotes.

Qon wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2024 8:11 pm Also, if I don't want to use Markdown but everyone I'm quoting has a sloppy Markdown soup of quotes then that would be annoying.

You know, you mentioning that got me thinking, too, what happens if someone posts in Markdown, then I quote them with Markdown disabled? Would it undo all of their formatting and put it in as plain text? Or, conversely, if I post with Markdown disabled and then someone with it enabled quotes me? That just seems like an unnecessary mess.

So yeah, no, I think I'm against this idea now, even if it were 100% optional on a per user basis.

I know the solution. This is a hard one, and its not a solution, it's the solution.

Migrate the forums on a newer engine and get rid of BB-codes.
BB-codes are the past century. They didn't evolve since, like, 2005? The post editor does not support any keyboard shortcuts, is ugly, and does not possess any QoL features. BB-codes are painful to be used manually, and lack of real-time preview also hurts.

Recently I participated in a discussion at Python forums (discuss.python.org, introduction/tutorial), and it uses Discourse open-source engine with powerful editing, quoting, and other tools, as well as real-time updates and many other features (including BB-forums migration scripts). It felt good to use.

About the quotation & mentioning...
You know what? BB-codes also do not ping on quotation. They ping on mention -- exactly as MD-related forums/discussions do. With the difference MD uses much simpiler @mention syntax.

P.S.
This forum even struggled to automatically parse discuss.pyhton.org as an URL.

P.P.S.
BB-codes do not support inline code injection. In 2024.

P.P.P.S.
They struggled to automatically parse discuss.python.org as correct URL even after I wrapped it in the <url> tag. (Srsly, click it!)
And it does not support character escaping, as MD does.

If there's something else out there that has added features over BBCode (like shortcut keys for formatting (like ctrl+i, etc), inline code support, etc) without bringing in the crap of Markdown and the devs want to go through the trouble of it, I'm fine with that. But I don't want something where *this* and the like gets interpreted as formatting, nor the need to know, remember, and type a backslash or whatever else in the cases where I want it to be ignored.

I gotta say, though, that the cases where I've needed to escape BBCode syntax has been pretty rare. Like, only when answering someone else's question of "how do I do this in BBCode?" rare. But it can be escaped by using a space (similar to markdown), or enabling the Disable BBCode option below the post editing box.
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