The Hydra Dilemma - A Coop Factorio Playthrough!

[Infectum13]

Episode 36 - 88 MPH

http://youtu.be/KccQsQyDL3I

I may have gone to far on pranks....hope I didn't screw the factory up.

[Infectum13]

No one (playing) in this series can ever make a plan in advance, given they have no idea what was built or messed up in the last 80 minutes or so of gameplay, given that each player has a different play style and skill level.

The best part of the series by far though is when everyone has looked at something, knowing that it needs to be fixed, finished or removed, and leaving it up to the next player whose going in blind to figure out that it needs to be taken care of.

The best thing anyone can do is leave something so obviously unfinished that it leaves a clue to the next person that something needs to be taken care of.

It's hard sometimes though when you have your own play style and you think you're fixing it, lol

[Infectum13]

The best part are the two quotes:

• Ok just very quickly guys, I wanna point out that I have zero goals for this episode. Zero. (1:57)
• I do have a plan for this episode (7:08)

I think contradictory is the right word for this

or instead of : mrgreen : better :mrgreenwire:

Oh I love such wordgamejokes

You can start out without a plan and make one during the next 5 minutes. That's how I usually play my factorio games, starting without a plan leaves room for improving stuff that is bad. Wanting to do something really badly can make you forget about other issues, although having no plan can cause stagnation so I guess finding a plan during the first 7 minutes is acceptable compromise.

I think fish did really well this episode, some of the things fixed I really wanted to shout out to each player for a while to fix, but didn't write here for spoiler reasons. Well, I am watching every episode in order though, so easier for me. And these players tend to fix problems I don't see too. I think this factory is shaping up quite well considering the circumstances.

Thanks for watching and helping us in the series. There are often times that we miss parts.

[ible]

Well played Infectum.

It seems like half the mistakes you make are from feeling time pressured. You get so focused on the time that your observational skills decrease.

Also since each playthrough is 20 minutes. That means 2 minutes is 10% of the total playthrough. You're feeling like its near the end around 15 minutes which is still 25% of your time until the end.

[ketil]

Infectum: I think you did well.

If you want to relax more during your episodes you might want to set an alarm and just forget about time until the alarm goes off. Set it to 20 minutes and you won't have time to wrap things up, but there is always the option of leaving something unfinished for the next player. Set it to 19 minutes and you will probably be able to wrap things up if it's not too much of a mess. Feel free to ignore or tweak my suggestion. Your episode is yours so you decide how to do it.

[JoshLittle]

@infectum (you can see the spoilers):
You achieved a important goal, because

batteries

are needed a lot (f.e. for

protection, energy and science

). That was hanging behind for a while, so it was good to solve it.

Some tips to improve your style a bit more (big hints with regard to your time stressing):

• right desition for the
  batterie
  -production. To just limit something more to handle with the remainings is like this strange second iron loop. Simple rule: If there is not enough: produce more. it would have been false to put down more
  blue potion assemblers
  because the existing ones didn't have enough input. Second rule: go for the real bottlenecks. You did it right this time, keep up on it.
• if you just need some
  pipes
  for a connection, better make some in the inventory instead of searching the whole episode for it. Nearly everything can be used if it was overproduced at some time and as long as you don't use the last materials it would be no shame to produce something that already could be made somewhere.
• you can input and output the stuff from every side. only liquids have defined inputs/outputs. your problem was that the belt was to close for a long arm inserter. a normal inserter would have done the job
• try to avoid substations for a simple inserter and plant-connection. it wasts material and as you saw also the space for that what you wanted to achieve. small and medium poles are the runners for those jobs.
• you managed to use both sides of a belt for one type of item in the past. now you need to learn to use both sides for two types. like for iron and copper that could have get in on the same belt.
• like you recognised: all the stuff you placed could also be done with robots. it is ok to use belts, but with a bit of preplaning it would be much easier. f.e.: if the plants are placed in a row side by side then you could do the top for inputs and the bottom for outputs. if a pipe is involved you can leave the a tile free with the underground pipe for inserters just like you did (you just didn't use it). it is also easier to use the same belt combination (= manage to get iron and copper on different sides of a belt) for all fabrics instead of making multiple combinations. you had 3 input belts which could be done with 1. try a bit on other maps and you will start to see where you have to place assemblers to get all the inputs, outputs and electrics around it.
• you can also turn things if they are already placed. just mark with the mouse and push R.

[Infectum13]

Well played Infectum.

It seems like half the mistakes you make are from feeling time pressured. You get so focused on the time that your observational skills decrease.

Also since each playthrough is 20 minutes. That means 2 minutes is 10% of the total playthrough. You're feeling like its near the end around 15 minutes which is still 25% of your time until the end.

That's a good way to look at it for sure. When you get focused you can get a lot done.

[Infectum13]

Infectum: I think you did well.

If you want to relax more during your episodes you might want to set an alarm and just forget about time until the alarm goes off. Set it to 20 minutes and you won't have time to wrap things up, but there is always the option of leaving something unfinished for the next player. Set it to 19 minutes and you will probably be able to wrap things up if it's not too much of a mess. Feel free to ignore or tweak my suggestion. Your episode is yours so you decide how to do it.

Could do it that way. I think the pressure makes it more fun though

[Infectum13]

@infectum (you can see the spoilers):
You achieved a important goal, because

batteries

are needed a lot (f.e. for

protection, energy and science

). That was hanging behind for a while, so it was good to solve it.

Some tips to improve your style a bit more (big hints with regard to your time stressing):

• right desition for the
  batterie
  -production. To just limit something more to handle with the remainings is like this strange second iron loop. Simple rule: If there is not enough: produce more. it would have been false to put down more
  blue potion assemblers
  because the existing ones didn't have enough input. Second rule: go for the real bottlenecks. You did it right this time, keep up on it.
• if you just need some
  pipes
  for a connection, better make some in the inventory instead of searching the whole episode for it. Nearly everything can be used if it was overproduced at some time and as long as you don't use the last materials it would be no shame to produce something that already could be made somewhere.
• you can input and output the stuff from every side. only liquids have defined inputs/outputs. your problem was that the belt was to close for a long arm inserter. a normal inserter would have done the job
• try to avoid substations for a simple inserter and plant-connection. it wasts material and as you saw also the space for that what you wanted to achieve. small and medium poles are the runners for those jobs.
• you managed to use both sides of a belt for one type of item in the past. now you need to learn to use both sides for two types. like for iron and copper that could have get in on the same belt.
• like you recognised: all the stuff you placed could also be done with robots. it is ok to use belts, but with a bit of preplaning it would be much easier. f.e.: if the plants are placed in a row side by side then you could do the top for inputs and the bottom for outputs. if a pipe is involved you can leave the a tile free with the underground pipe for inserters just like you did (you just didn't use it). it is also easier to use the same belt combination (= manage to get iron and copper on different sides of a belt) for all fabrics instead of making multiple combinations. you had 3 input belts which could be done with 1. try a bit on other maps and you will start to see where you have to place assemblers to get all the inputs, outputs and electrics around it.
• you can also turn things if they are already placed. just mark with the mouse and push R.

I didn't know you could rotate something that is already down! That will help a LOT. I thought the substation was a good idea. It covered the whole area, and was less messy then putting down poles. I did miss the two sides of the belt though, that would have been a cleaner way to do it. Thanks for the tips!!

[bonob]

Before you switch to 0.10.9, guys, someone *got* to do a prank with the item bomb!

[JoshLittle]

But funny is only the moment of a longer loading when you realise that you shouldn't have mined that box. Not if the stuff is just laying around

[Xterminator]

Alright guys my episode is live!
Infectum left us in quite a pickle... It is safe to say that we may not get out of it... Watch and find out!

Oh S#!%... Runn!!

[Blackence]

That prank turned out to be a lot of fun! We need a mod for that.

Massive biter attacks that actually kill your defenses.

I hope FKOD manages to run back home alive.

[Xterminator]

Glad you enjoyed. I know I had fun!

I tested it afterward, and unless he does something really dump he should be able to get back.

[JoshLittle]

Ok, so here are some tips for you:

• It's not your fault that they came in, but after it you could have watched the minimap to see the alerts. It was clear that there were more in and until they don't go back to a wall where turrets are, they could live there a long time.
• You can cancel the construction-ghosts with the deconstruction tool and you don't have to do each manually.

I feel like it's the right time for my prank. But root hasn't used it yet. Perhaps someone else would. So if someone wants a good non-violent prank without any biters involved which costs the following person some nerves and more time to start the actual episode than it costs for you to set the prank up...
Maybe Infectum has qualified for it

[pyrolytic_tungsten]

I know it's an old issue but can someone tell me why a complete switch was made from coal to solid fuel. With the amount of coal in the base there's no reason coal couldn't completely support steam generators for many hours. For the amounts of oil on the map I would have just made more tanks to store heavy and light oil instead of turning it into solid fuel. Once blue science is up one of the first things I research is advanced oil processing so I can get my light/heavy oil cracked to petroleum gas. I'm also the type of player that sets up all but the largest of oil fields in one go since if you have sufficient resources it will take less time to set stuff up in one go rather than spread it out over a number of trips..

The only map I used solid fuel in my boilers with coal backup is when my starting oil field looked like this:

[Blackence]

Wow, I can't reach that many oil wells in my current map when allowing an estimated 1 minute train ride. Nice starting area. (Okay, I'm using the ressource spawner overhaul mod because I love trains so much, that's why there's no abundance of ressources on my map.)

Still, I use solid fuel for trains (and solar for power). Simply because oil is technically available in unlimited amounts, even if it requires you to use a few hundred "depleted" oil wells. Coal, on the other hand, is always finite and requires manual work to keep the miners going and find new coal. So in the very very long term, solid fuel > coal.

[DaveMcW]

I know it's an old issue but can someone tell me why a complete switch was made from coal to solid fuel. With the amount of coal in the base there's no reason coal couldn't completely support steam generators for many hours. For the amounts of oil on the map I would have just made more tanks to store heavy and light oil instead of turning it into solid fuel.

The ideal approach is to make a single tank for each, and use all petroleum gas to beeline for Advanced Oil Processing.

Someone ended up using all petroleum gas to build giant chests of sulfur and plastic instead. It just went downhill from there.

[JoshLittle]

.. can someone tell me why a complete switch was made from coal to solid fuel.

Actualy I can.

• While Alex was setting up the first oil stuff in Ep. 9 he wanted to set up solid fuel factory anyway
• Root desided in Ep. 10 to not just ignore the two plants but to use it for the power generation and so he built the first solid fuel belt and (kind of) underhand he indicated where the next power plant should stay
• Fish was surprised about solid fuel, but was weakend by the stone prank and felt therefor for the mental forces to continue the (partly deformed) power plant
• He was thinking for it in Ep 14, but finally Alex expended the solid fuel belt to the old coal belt in Ep 19 ("because why not")
• Root was ripping down Alex' so called backup (which was not functioning anymore), and so coal was gone and never been seen again.

So in summary: Alex is more the reasoning guy in the group and he was the driving force for setting up solid fuel and for breaking down coal, because.... "anyway" and "why not". There you have the reason

[FishSandwich]

lol, that is a pretty damn good summary for why coal was replaced with solid fuel, and a good example of how unorganized the Hydra Dilemma is.