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[0.13.x][0.13.3] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:56 pm
by Athmagor
Hello all,
After discovering Bob's Mods I was very impressed by the scope of the modification. I played tens of hours with the mod and had so much fun doing that. However, I always felt Bobingabout stopped at 90% as there was still a distinction between stock and mod items, research and recipies. For example - iron and other gears, iron/copper and other ores were in different tabs. The technologies were missing quite a few prerequisites (especially the late game ones around titanium and tungsten processing). After overtaking the stock electronics in the mods, technologies had wrong prerequisites set as well. I'm a completionist and those bits irked me quite a bit.
Initially I embarked on creating a separate "ultimate" mod containing all the mods together and having all those omissions fixed. However, apart from being in a direct violation of the license (don't do it at home, kids!
), it was quickly apparent that it won't be sustainable. Bobingabout has been and still is actively making many changes (kudos to him for that!
). It is also clear that he puts priority on flexibility and compatibility with other overhaul mods so mixing and matching is possible.
The second approach and much more sensible one was to create a separate mod that would modify Bob's mods content in a non-intrusive way. This way it would not violate the license and would be easier to maintain.
After a few discussions with Bobingabout and reviewing the changes I was encouraged to release this mod to a wider audience.
Changes vs. Bob's mods:
- Reordered a lot of items and recipes. See the current order in the screenshots below.
I still don't have a good idea how to order the resources tab - should it be: powders, plates and beams; or some other way of categorizing, like: direct smelting, chemistry processing, derivatives.
I introduced many more groups so the items are aligned vertically as well (alien packs and sciences, belts, inserters, or various container handling in the fluids tab).
Hopefully it all makes it easier to find things around.
- Put all missing prerequisites into the technology tree. Some of those missing prerequisites have already been put into the latest Bob's Logistics mod (those changes have been incorporated in the current version of the tweaks). Expect more of them to find their way into the base mods over time.
The idea behind it was to make sure you cannot research something and then being unable to craft it due to missing stuff.
- Removed the blue pack recipe from batteries technology and created a separate technology just for it (Research). It allowed me to put a prerequisite on all technologies using it. Then I expanded the idea altogether for green packs (new technology - Basic Research), purple (?) packs (existing Advanced Research) and alien packs (existing Alien Technology and Alien Research). Hopefully it will make the progression bit clearer.
The idea behind is exactly the same as in the point above - now you cannot even attempt to research a technology before mastering the science packs on this level.
- Small tweaks to unlocks in some technologies. For example - barrel is unlocked now in Barrelling instead of Fluid handling. The same goes for crude oil barrelling.
- Small changes to some of the recipes, for example - all higher level transport belts and splitter require lubricant. Express transport belts and splitter require steel gears instead of iron ones to make the progression somewhat smoother (than jumping straight from iron to titanium).
This mod requires all Bob's Mods to be present and it has a hard dependence on them. It also requires to all feature to be enabled (essentially having the default options unchanged). It doesn't do much checking, so if you mix and match or restrict features, expect to get errors. Also, there is no checking for other overhaul mods (it shouldn't be much of a problem, though, as there is almost nothing new being introduced here).
The best way to experience it is to start a new game (and to go through the whole technology tree), however, it should be perfectly fine to load an existing save. If you decide to do the latter, run this command to reset the recipes and technologies:
Code: Select all
/c for index, force in pairs(game.forces) do force.reset_recipes() force.reset_technologies() end
Please treat it as a research project and please do leave your feedback. It will be invaluable for Bobingabout to see your impression and thoughts. If there is enough support, some of those changes might be incorporated in the Bob's Mods.
Kind regards,
Ath
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 9:12 pm
by Boogieman14
Interesting, just starting a new game, so I'll add this. A suggestion: move basic research to the end of the initially available research choices so Automation is displayed first (minor, but makes the transition from base game a bit smoother
)
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:58 pm
by bobingabout
Just as a point of interest... When I sorted these tabs myself, the intermediates (Mostly added by MCI) were ordered in 2 different ways... (And probably not very strictly followed while expanding the lists)
The Recipe section (EG, in your inventory screen) has the intermediates tab (not the parts tab, parts tab was sorted by item type both ways) was ordered by what machine makes them. Furnace, chemical furnace, mixing furnace, chemical plant, assembly machine etc..
The Items section (EG, when selecting an item in a logistics filter) had the items ordered by the type of item, so for example plates were split into 2 groups, elemental, or alloy.
This is why most of the intermediates has a subgroup listed on both the item and the recipe, where most of the parts and products only have a subgroup listed on the item.
I'm not sure what Ath changed them to, because I've not been following it THAT closely, I just know he's changed a lot of the subgroups around, I've mostly just been skimming, and implementing a few small changes, like adding prerequisites so far. They do look pretty close in the screenshots though. Not quite sure why Copper and Iron are on their own row there though.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 9:43 am
by Boogieman14
bobingabout wrote:The Recipe section (EG, in your inventory screen) has the intermediates tab (not the parts tab, parts tab was sorted by item type both ways) was ordered by what machine makes them. Furnace, chemical furnace, mixing furnace, chemical plant, assembly machine etc..
The Items section (EG, when selecting an item in a logistics filter) had the items ordered by the type of item, so for example plates were split into 2 groups, elemental, or alloy.
While this sounds like a logical division to make when you're familiar with all the terms and processes involved, from a player standpoint it's probably less ideal. I guess this explains why I've had many occasions where I was pretty sure I saw a certain item in one spot when setting the recipe, but couldn't find it easily when setting the corresponding filter on the output smart inserter (I probably subconsciously blamed it on there being far more items on the filter selection, but this would explain it far better I think
). From a gameplay perspective, it's probably much easier to have each item in the same position for each selection screen.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 12:17 pm
by bobingabout
Boogieman14 wrote:bobingabout wrote:The Recipe section (EG, in your inventory screen) has the intermediates tab (not the parts tab, parts tab was sorted by item type both ways) was ordered by what machine makes them. Furnace, chemical furnace, mixing furnace, chemical plant, assembly machine etc..
The Items section (EG, when selecting an item in a logistics filter) had the items ordered by the type of item, so for example plates were split into 2 groups, elemental, or alloy.
While this sounds like a logical division to make when you're familiar with all the terms and processes involved, from a player standpoint it's probably less ideal. I guess this explains why I've had many occasions where I was pretty sure I saw a certain item in one spot when setting the recipe, but couldn't find it easily when setting the corresponding filter on the output smart inserter (I probably subconsciously blamed it on there being far more items on the filter selection, but this would explain it far better I think
). From a gameplay perspective, it's probably much easier to have each item in the same position for each selection screen.
Pretty sure there was a poll about it back when I was doing it, and this is what most people wanted.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:15 pm
by StoneLegion
Always liked the idea of bobs mod but I wish there was a version that hardly touched vanilla but once you beat vanilla then you start working on all the new researching etc. So green chips stay the same etc. Oh well I doubt that will change but it's neat to see mods for mods out there
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 2:15 pm
by Boogieman14
Continuing on my earlier feedback, I think Logistics 1 is hidden too far down the tree right now. That's probably because fast inserters require basic electronic boards, but splitter and underground don't and they're quite useful setting up the initial research automation.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 5:27 pm
by Athmagor
A suggestion: move basic research to the end of the initially available research choices so Automation is displayed first (minor, but makes the transition from base game a bit smoother
)
That's a very good idea. Thought about it at some point as currently it is the first technology on the popup screen. Somehow it slipped through the cracks, though, when I was focusing on other things. Will make a note and reorder it to be the last one for "red only" technologies.
Boogieman14 wrote:Continuing on my earlier feedback, I think Logistics 1 is hidden too far down the tree right now. That's probably because fast inserters require basic electronic boards, but splitter and underground don't and they're quite useful setting up the initial research automation.
Yeah, unfortunately it is an unwanted consequence of the decision to make sure you can craft everything that a technology unlocks. The fast inserter is a sore thumb in this technology. Ideally it would be moved out somewhere further down the line and logistics-1 could be then available a bit earlier.
However, having said that, at this point you will have Automation 1 done so provided you can supply the ingredients to chests surrounding crafting machines by hand, you can get through red only science even without transport belts.
Apart from those bits, how is it so far?
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 10:45 pm
by Boogieman14
Athmagor wrote:Apart from those bits, how is it so far?
I must admit, after starting the basic electronic boards setup, I realised I didn't really feel like going through that much detail for yet another game, so I parked it for now and started a game with just a subset of bob's mods
And since your mod requires all bob's mods to be present, it wasn't an option to give tweaks more of a try this time around
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 8:18 pm
by eidalac
For Bobs Power V0.12.6, this gets an error loading. Looks like the basic accumulators 2/3 have been removed from the mod, and this is still referencing them.
The 2 lines with them need to be removed from the data-final-fixes.lua file for it to load. I've attached an edited version. So far no in-game issues with it other than that.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 6:05 pm
by Athmagor
eidalac wrote:For Bobs Power V0.12.6, this gets an error loading. Looks like the basic accumulators 2/3 have been removed from the mod, and this is still referencing them.
The 2 lines with them need to be removed from the data-final-fixes.lua file for it to load. I've attached an edited version. So far no in-game issues with it other than that.
Thanks for posting those changes. Had to take a break from Factorio due to real life commitments. Will try to update to the recent version of Bob's Mods this week.
How's the first impression when it actually loads, though?
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:15 am
by MakiabelMFE
Fantastic tweaks Athmagor, I really like how things are organized, and vanilla items consolidated in the tabs that would make sense for them to be with Bob's mods items (like iron gears with the other gears!). As eidalac pointed out it had an issue with 0.12.6 version of Bob's power but I just matched the changes from it to the files in your mod and it's working good so far.
Great work!
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:21 pm
by Athmagor
Updated to be compatible with the newest version of Bob's mods. The new accumulators are now ordered again.
Also, the new research technologies are now ordered better as well.
I'm glad you guys enjoy using the tweaks
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.0] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 2:00 pm
by eidalac
Athmagor wrote:Thanks for posting those changes. Had to take a break from Factorio due to real life commitments. Will try to update to the recent version of Bob's Mods this week.
How's the first impression when it actually loads, though?
Sure thing!
I defiantly wouldn't want to play Bobs without this - Bob's definitely pushes the number of items the UI was planned for. The upcoming search feature will help, but it's still better to have it well organized.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:48 pm
by Minks
The mod unfortunately adds 5x Module Contact to the level 4 modules while it already exists in the recipe. That makes it so that the ingredient appears twice and the inserters only take care of one of the two, which makes automation impossible.
I fixed it in the data-final-fixes.lua and when I start a save where I didn't research the module 4 yet it seems to be fixed but in my current save where I found the issue it seems unfixable
It still shows what you can see on the screenshot. Deactivating the tweaks mod fixes it but I would like to avoid that. Any help would be appreciated.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:46 pm
by bobingabout
If you change a recipe, it needs to be updated in game manually.
Press ~ to open the console then use the following command
Code: Select all
/c game.player.force.reset_recipes()
If that doesn't work, you may need to use an iteration version instead.
Code: Select all
/c for index, force in pairs(game.forces) do force.reset_recipes() end
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:48 pm
by Minks
bobingabout wrote:If you change a recipe, it needs to be updated in game manually.
Press ~ to open the console then use the following command
Code: Select all
/c game.player.force.reset_recipes()
If that doesn't work, you may need to use an iteration version instead.
Code: Select all
/c for index, force in pairs(game.forces) do force.reset_recipes() end
The first one did it, thank you very much!
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 6:49 pm
by Athmagor
Minks wrote:The mod unfortunately adds 5x Module Contact to the level 4 modules while it already exists in the recipe. That makes it so that the ingredient appears twice and the inserters only take care of one of the two, which makes automation impossible.
I fixed it in the data-final-fixes.lua and when I start a save where I didn't research the module 4 yet it seems to be fixed but in my current save where I found the issue it seems unfixable
It still shows what you can see on the screenshot. Deactivating the tweaks mod fixes it but I would like to avoid that. Any help would be appreciated.
Mod updated and this issue fixed. I have no idea why it was duplicated there in the first place. I went as far as modules 12.3 and it was there as a ingredient.
Sorry about that (^.^)
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.2] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 1:24 pm
by donkeystealing
Trying this out, lots of things I always wondered why they are in certain categories.
Re: [0.12.x][0.12.1] Bob's Tweaks mod
Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:36 pm
by bobingabout
Athmagor wrote:Mod updated and this issue fixed. I have no idea why it was duplicated there in the first place. I went as far as modules 12.3 and it was there as a ingredient.
Looking at the changelog, although it doesn't state what I did exactly, it is likely a change made in 0.12.3 which states some recipe changes, so if you went back to 0.12.2, it might not be there.