Bob mods for 0.12 General Topic.

[cpy]

Solid fuel produced is already 10x higher without modules than it should be according to energy conservation laws (rough estimate based on isolated electric networks).

[bobingabout]

The problem with the solid fuel thing though is if you start tweaking numbers hydrogen becomes too expensive to use for any other product. Also if it costs more energy to produce than it gives back, it becomes rather pointless using it as a fuel.

Also, the efficiency of the MK2 steam engines and boilers is bordering on the unrealistic. MK3 gives you more out than you put in.


What do you think of the new void pump that I added to plates mod? It specifically works only with Liquid air (Which is a bit... why? Because you make that one from nothing as a single product), hidrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Chlorine, Water and Lithia Water.

[aklesey1]

Question:
Bob will change recipies for:
1) Rocket silo
2) Rocket part
3) Rocket control unit
4) Satellite
5) Low density structure

I'm asking because these element have dependency to electronic techonlogies and module technologies
May be it will belong to bobwarfare technologies in some part and to your electronics mod?

[cpy]

Electrolysis cost a lot of power, so that's why you don't use it as fuel. Anyway solar power + hydrogen production -> 1 chest full of solid fuel is accumulator worth thousands of normal ones.

Use solar panel excess power during the day to create hydrogen and use hydrogen fuel during night time as battery. Not very clean but it's damn efficient one.

[kiba]

What do you think of the new void pump that I added to plates mod? It specifically works only with Liquid air (Which is a bit... why? Because you make that one from nothing as a single product), hidrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Chlorine, Water and Lithia Water.

I have no idea what and how to use void pumps and what they're good for, currently, though I am trying it out.

[bobingabout]

I have no idea what and how to use void pumps and what they're good for

Connect it to a pipe, supply power, the resource that enter the pipe disapears into the void!

It's something people were requesting to get rid of resources.

[cpw]

Hey bob, I found a small issue with your smart variant inserters. They don't interact with the .12 circuit network. You have to copy some new properties from the vanilla smart inserter (wire attachment point data) and they then connect and work fine. Hope this helps!

[crysanja]

played some more.
havent seen any bugs so far =)

few things i would like to see improved =)

A
i dont see any mk2 electric furneces, the multi-purpuse furnces with 3 crafting speed seem a bit high on material requirements, to smelt iron/copper with 3 speed.

---
B
i only looked at laser rifle batteries, but the higher levels seem kind of unreasonable on battery needs.
5 batteries for a basic is fine, but 5 additional ones for each upgrade seems a bit too much for just 5 additional damage and no magazine size.
i would like to see either less batteries used or an increase in magazine size(like 50%+ of the previous one)

---
C
im not sure if its intented or not, but t3 boilers use inver and engines use titan, t4 boilers use tungsten, not sure if there are t4 engine.

---
D
some tech could be more gated, it would prevent the player from researching things he cant use.

---
E(edit)
inserters grab more than 50% of the stream from spilters. dont think this is a mod issue.

[Duros1394]

I'm getting a bobs ores error on startup
Error in assignID, 'diamond-ore' was not recognised id of item

[bobingabout]

A
i dont see any mk2 electric furneces, the multi-purpuse furnces with 3 crafting speed seem a bit high on material requirements, to smelt iron/copper with 3 speed.

The Electric Mixing Furnace and Electric Chemical Furnace can be seen as upgrades over the standard Electric furnace too, so you effectively missed a step there.

B
i only looked at laser rifle batteries, but the higher levels seem kind of unreasonable on battery needs.
5 batteries for a basic is fine, but 5 additional ones for each upgrade seems a bit too much for just 5 additional damage and no magazine size.
i would like to see either less batteries used or an increase in magazine size(like 50%+ of the previous one)

All recipes for the Laser magazine are effectively the same with a different lense (Glass + all Gems), they are not upgraded from 1 to the next, so they all cost 4 batteries, 1 case and 1 lense material, not 4, 8, 12... etc batteries.

C
im not sure if its intented or not, but t3 boilers use inver and engines use titan, t4 boilers use tungsten, not sure if there are t4 engine.

The difference is intentional. The boilers are made from "Heat proof" material, which goes steel, invar, tungsten etc, the engines use the standard strong metals chain to combat friction instead.

D
some tech could be more gated, it would prevent the player from researching things he cant use.

I realy need to go through and add more prerequisites to a lot of the researchs. Most of them that don't have the limiters are basically down to me doing the bare minimum to get it working, then forgetting I did that later.

I'm getting a bobs ores error on startup
Error in assignID, 'diamond-ore' was not recognised id of item

I'll take a look.
I'm guessing you're not using default settings.

EDIT: data.lua line 47 (I think) should read:

Code: Select all

if (bobmods.ores.EnableGemOre == true and bobmods.ores.UnsortedGemOre == false) or bobmods.ores.GemsFromOtherOres == true then

I will upload version 0.12.1 shortly.

[cpw]

Hey bobingabout, so I posted a vague suggestion last night.

Here's the diff for the one inserter I fixed (because I needed it on my map)

Code: Select all

--- a/boblogistics_0.12.0/prototypes/more-inserter.lua
+++ b/boblogistics_0.12.0/prototypes/more-inserter.lua
@@ -322,6 +322,20 @@
         height = 46
       }
     },
+    circuit_wire_connection_point =
+    {
+      shadow =
+      {
+        red = {0, 0},
+        green = {0, 0}
+      },
+      wire =
+      {
+        red = {0, 0},
+        green = {0, 0}
+      }
+    },
+    circuit_wire_max_distance = 7.5,
   },
 
   {

With this patch, the red/green wires can connect to this smart inserter variant, and it can participate in "circuit" operations again.

The same needs to be done for the other "smart" type inserters. I hope this helps!

[bobingabout]

Okay. Updates uploaded for almost all the mods.

Ores:
* Fixed the Gems check with backwards flag to fix a crash

Mining:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4 usage instead of Alien Science Pack if available.

MCI:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4 usage instead of Alien Science Pack if available.
* Added Inventory size config option. Default size is double of normal, as it was in Tech mod.

Assembly Machines:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4 usage instead of Alien Science Pack if available.

Modules:
* Fixed a bug with the Lab

Power:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4 usage instead of Alien Science Pack if available.

Logistics:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4 usage instead of Alien Science Pack if available.
* Added vehicle collision sound to all inserters.
* Added Wire nodes to Smart Inserters.
* Added Logistic based researchs (Toolbelt and Player Logistic Slots) from Tech mod.

Warefare:
* Added automatic Science Pack 4, Gold science pack and coloured Alien Science Pack usage if available.

Tech:
* Added Alien Lab, Only available if all 6 coloured alien artifacts (Available in Enemies mod) are found.
* Added Multicoloured Alien science packs for use in Alien Lab
* Gold Science Pack is now a streamlined science pack 1+2+3 for use in Alien lab
* Removed Logistic based researchs (Toolbelt and Player Logistic Slots)
* Removed inventory size increase
* Science pack 4 now takes Express Belt, Processing unit(or Logic board), Lithium Ion Battery(or Electric Engine) and Silicon Nitride(Or Electric engine). (only one engine even if both Li-Ion and SiN are missing)

That science change really bumps up the research difficulty.

[code99]

Do these mods work for factorio 0.12.1?

[kiba]

Do these mods work for factorio 0.12.1?

Yes.

[code99]

Do these mods work for factorio 0.12.1?

Yes.

sweet!

[crysanja]

so a few more things =)

A
you can not replace long handed inserters with fast long handed inserstes -- dont know if there are more build-replace problems with other inserters.
it works fine for basic inserters replaced with fast, even fast replaced with longhanded Oo

B
maybe im just silly, but i cant find uhm long handed in(near?) inserters?(from -4 to +3, with a normal longheaded inserter being -4 to +4)
im also a bit confused with all thouse inserters =) not sure if there is a better way to sort them.

C
youre mod is sometimes complicated and this is a good thing =) - however it would be nice to pause the game sometimes to figure out a production chain.

D
propably just an update thing, but my salt/water -> H2/Cl2 electrolysers mk1 stoped working with updating the mod, needed to reselect the recept.

E
i started the game with all settings on normal, biter progression seems a bit slow, not sure about the attack sizes, 2 normal turrets with normal ammo seems todo fine - i just started producing mk2 prod modules as a time stamp ))

F
maybe you could add a total game time counter - like the clock? then we can speek better about biter progression. =)

G
i think its a good idea, but propably way too much work, at the research selection screen it would be nice to have the highest sciencepack displayed in the upper right corner of each research icon.

---

i must say im realy impressed with you bob.
you responed to everything - even if im too silly to get it right in the first place =)

[kiba]

Sniper turrets seem a bit overpowered to the point that I don't really need machine gun turrets unless I don't have enough snipers.

[Narc]

[...]maybe you could add a total game time counter - like the clock? then we can speek better about biter progression. =)

On that note, try my mod: Evolution Factor Indicator. Biter evolution and play time, both on screen at all times.

Of note, while I was researching for a reddit comment, I found the biter evolution modifiers were all halved in vanilla Factorio going from 0.11 to 0.12. Perhaps that's what you're seeing?

[bobingabout]

Sniper turrets seem a bit overpowered to the point that I don't really need machine gun turrets unless I don't have enough snipers.

I re-ballanced them to match the reballance for standard gun turrets. Perhaps I should half the damage output.

They would then be "Crap" firepower wise because of the increased range. sounds fair?

A
you can not replace long handed inserters with fast long handed inserstes -- dont know if there are more build-replace problems with other inserters.
it works fine for basic inserters replaced with fast, even fast replaced with longhanded Oo

will look into it.

EDIT: Just been through all the inserters added by my mod. They all include the line:

Code: Select all

fast_replaceable_group = "inserter",

so they should all be replacable. If they're not, I don't know why.

EDIT2: Basegame long handed inserter was changed to:

Code: Select all

fast_replaceable_group = "long-handed-inserter",

So that's why.

B
maybe im just silly, but i cant find uhm long handed in(near?) inserters?(from -4 to +3, with a normal longheaded inserter being -4 to +4)
im also a bit confused with all thouse inserters =) not sure if there is a better way to sort them.

The combinations only have short or long in, not near of far, because the input side of near and short are the same, as are the input sides of long and far. There should be 8 combinations in total.

C
youre mod is sometimes complicated and this is a good thing =) - however it would be nice to pause the game sometimes to figure out a production chain.

There is a pause button in the game, I can't remember what it is though.

D
propably just an update thing, but my salt/water -> H2/Cl2 electrolysers mk1 stoped working with updating the mod, needed to reselect the recept.

There is no change from 0.12.0 to 0.12.1 that could cause this, and I'm fairly sure there wasn't a change from 0.7.11 or whatever it was numbered for 0.11.22 either, so I don't know what is going on here.

E
i started the game with all settings on normal, biter progression seems a bit slow, not sure about the attack sizes, 2 normal turrets with normal ammo seems todo fine - i just started producing mk2 prod modules as a time stamp ))

I changed nothing, as someone mentioned they think it was changed in the base game, maybe this is it?

F
maybe you could add a total game time counter - like the clock? then we can speek better about biter progression. =)

I had nothing planned, but it should be possible to make the clock show more than just the current game time.

G
i think its a good idea, but propably way too much work, at the research selection screen it would be nice to have the highest sciencepack displayed in the upper right corner of each research icon.

The only way I think I could do this would be to edit the icons to include that in their image. The biggest problem with that is that some of them just point to a lower resolution icon picture instead. I would have to resize a copy to add the picture, and they would probably look a bit crap compared to the higher resolution ones.
There's also another issue that tiered researchs use the same icon for every tier, I would have to change that to an icon per tier, which is filebloat, and would use more vram.

---

i must say im realy impressed with you bob.
you responed to everything - even if im too silly to get it right in the first place =)

Thank you.

[cpy]

I was thinking, if you want to create fuel with better values here's an idea!

N2O (nitrous oxide) you can make it:

Haber-Bosch process

3 H2 + N2 -> 2 NH3

Ostwald process

2 NH3 + 2 O2 -> N20 + 3 H2O

solid fuel + N2O -> NOS fuel or Nitro fuel for that turbo boost you need! (or maybe just more MJ like 25 )


Need rocket fuel? Hydrazine!

First make Hydrogen peroxide with anthraquinone process (complicated catalyst reaction where basically all reactions equals to)
(complicated stuff: 2-alkyl-anthrahydroquinone, which is generated before from the corresponding 2-alkyl-anthraquinone by catalytic hydrogenation with palladium)

H2 + O2 -> H2O2 (nothing else is used)

Ugine-Kuhlmann process

2 NH3 + H2O2 → H2N-NH2 + 2 H2O

So much for unused nitrogen