Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post all other topics which do not belong to any other category.
evopwr
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2017 1:45 am
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by evopwr »

heh, yeh, I know what you mean. the only option is to either ignore the stored bits (like you've done), or temporarily place requester chests strategically everywhere, to try and recycle everything back in to the loop. But then you get Buffer chests, and have to remove all the Requester chests anyway.

JimBarracus
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 365
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:14 am
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by JimBarracus »

My current map (no biters, normal resources) has a big roundabout around the main base.
With several lanes and enough space for the trains to accelerate to full speed before merging in.
I watched it for quite a while and never noticed trains to slow down for each other.

Anyway, for smelting I often use at least one train per ore field.
Almost depleted fields share one train. I usually use 2-3 trains for one big ore field (10 mil+).

I use centralized smelting for the main base.
Oil refining is remote because I found a really large oil field. Things like plastik and sulfuric acid are produced there and brought to the main facility.
I am currently setting up another grid for rocketry. It is basically another branch heading north to ore fields. It is connected to the main rail grid but I try to avoid sending trains between them. Rocket production will be train-based. Three facitlites for the intermediates that will be gathered in a relativly central place.

In my deathworld I build fenced and guarded train tracks with supply for spare parts, flamethrowers, artillery and bot repair.
I build two parallel track systems, but so far apart you cant see both on the mini map at the same time (don't know how many chunks apart).
When I claimed enough land I demolish the inside protection and connect the resources in between.
The inside track for resources is one way and forms a loop.
This way it is relativly easy to claim land in a fast manner.

zOldBulldog
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by zOldBulldog »

evopwr wrote:
Mon Sep 10, 2018 1:27 am
sounds interesting, would love to see some pics and feedback after you try it!
I started on the test (maybe permanent) run of (3). I have not yet made much progress but I can report a little:

- I used the start of this to get my OnTrack achievement using a "get out of the stone age" bare minimum startup base. It worked, with a couple minutes to spare. Nothing special about it but let me know if anybody cares to see screenshots before I dismantle it.
- After that I am using plate, still and other basics from that startup to get me going.
- I couldn't get any clear answers (at least not this soon) on the magnitude of throughput advantages from using extra locomotives, so I just bit the bullet and decided to go with 4-4 trains on the main track early on, but to design the rail to support 8-8 trains, and to unload from the rear of the train. Ore trains will probably be the same old 1-2 trains.
- Step 1 was to decide where to put the center of the base intersection and build a little rail from there. I ended up designing an Left hand Drive 4-track/4-way intersection based on the Standard intersection but it will connects to my other 4-track blueprints. I chose the Standard design because it has fairly high throughput, and is quite compact regardless of train size... so it should work even with the 8-8 trains (at least I hope it will!).
Step 2 was to choose a spot for my production mall and to begin positioning the inbound stacker and unload stations that will feed the production mini-bus. Using the Madzuri unload I should eventually get 2 blue belts per materials 4-wagon train. As it is half of what those trains can support I am not worried about the time from the stacker to the unload. I hope to finish it tomorrow and post some screenshots. I don't really plan to use this materials unload until later, since I have lots of resources at beltable distances, but I needed to build the station to clearly identify where the minibus and production malls will go.
- Step 2 will be to start on my MiniMart, that starts its life as a 3x3 chunk Jumpstart base and later becomes my "low volume mall" (which covers about 80‰ of all items). Maybe I will manage to start on it tomorrow, maybe later.

Going to bed now. But I am quite excited about this little project. It feels like it will be the first base I make that I can call "just right". And it is also what I hope will be the final test for many of my blueprints.

zOldBulldog
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by zOldBulldog »

Screenshots follow, one per post because the forum has become buggy. It is losing all but the first screenshot in a post.

1) Bootstrap base to get out of Stone Age. Normally it is smaller, this is what was needed for OnTrack like a Pro. This is still providing my supplies.
The attachment BootstrapOutOfStoneAge.jpg is no longer available
Attachments
BootstrapOutOfStoneAge.jpg
BootstrapOutOfStoneAge.jpg (1.15 MiB) Viewed 4415 times

zOldBulldog
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by zOldBulldog »

2) Powerplant after a little expanding. Only used the left side for OnTrack.

This powerplant will become self-regulating, shutdown when not needed due to other power sources, and has steam backup to handle power spikes. Right now the pumps are always active because not having an accumulator reads as "no other power available, generate some" and not having steam tanks reads as "there is no steam, generate some".
Attachments
power.jpg
power.jpg (1.06 MiB) Viewed 4414 times

zOldBulldog
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by zOldBulldog »

3) As you can see it was a pain to find a good place to build.
- The OnTrack bootstrap is at the bottom center of the screen.
- I had to go to the center of this screen to find a place with enough space for the horizontal and vertical "center of my base" intersection. This is a variation of the "Standard" fairly high throughput intersection that can handle 2-8-2 trains (same direction loco) gracefully.
- I reserved 3 chunks in each direction from the intersection so that I can replace it later with something nicer. That pushed the location of my initial 3x3 chunk "MiniMart" primary bootstrap towards the north.
- The MiniMart will hang off the small bus I use to feed my "prodution factory lines" (the bus will be a vertical band left of the 1828% oil patch). The stacker and unload station array will eventually feed that bus. To figure out the distances... I had to at least build the rail portion of the bus feeding.
- Finally, the lone station above the bus unload station is the beginning of the array of loading stations for my Pax/construction trains, that will be loaded by bots from the MiniMart and other production mall areas along the bus.
Attachments
map.jpg
map.jpg (385.9 KiB) Viewed 4413 times

zOldBulldog
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by zOldBulldog »

4) Figures. My luck had to place my MiniMart (you see part of the ghost of the pad it will go on) and its Pax/Construction loading stations on the right... smack in the middle of a dead tree patch. In the screenshot you can also see the incoming stone belt under construction. Iron, Copper and Coal belts from nearby deposits as well as Crude Oil from the nearby patch and water (probably from that puddle by the train tracks) will follow next... and I'll finally be able to start building the MiniMart that will supply me of everything, including bots and what I need for Nuclear power.

Oh, and there are two uranium deposits way left in the yet unexplored part of the map (I remember from the preview :) )
Attachments
Minimart.jpg
Minimart.jpg (1.21 MiB) Viewed 4412 times

Malandark
Manual Inserter
Manual Inserter
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:54 am
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by Malandark »

Base Structure.jpg
Base Structure.jpg (258.52 KiB) Viewed 4372 times
I'm currently nearing 300 hours setting up my latest base, (have around 1,700 hours in total playing Factorio) all of which has been spent setting up my Iron and Copper Smelters and not much else other than providing enough power to test these out.

My approach to setting this base up is one based on the principles of a humble plant that in turn, becomes a pyramid.

As shown in the above screen shot (which is still under very heavy construction), I have built up a 'root' system from the bottom of my pyramid that is comprised of separate rail lines, each of these 'root' lines is dedicated to a particular resource. In the screen shot I have from left to right, The Coal line, Copper Line, Iron Line. Because each of these 'root' lines never connect directly to any other line the A.I pathing will never be able to find a shortcut that forces one resource supply train to cross over another. In past play-through's I have found it pays to scout for large patches of resources quite a distance away from the starting area, as shown in the above screen shot. I tend to only setup mining outposts on 15+Million ore plots as anything less will dry up quite quickly.

I have debated many times if it is better to setup mining outposts with on-site factories and while there is the added benefit of getting large amounts of compression from transported items going from mining outposts to the main base, having everything neatly and logically placed inside the main base wins every-time for me at least.

At the bottom of my 'base' I am setting up a whole chain of Iron/Copper drop-offs, smelters and collection points that will span across the bottom of my base, so all these supply trains will never clog up or use the rail lines the higher up my pyramid grows. As I need more smelters, they 'grow' horizontally outwards, copper expands to the left, Iron to the right. Having all these smelters at the bottom of my base keeps all my supply trains traffic manageable and close to my mining outposts.

Using a Rail Grid System is a must, after many hours of trail and error my preferred, overall train setup is L-CCCC (1 Loco, 4 Cargo Wagons) using a 2 rail (RHD) system. I am a great believer in K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid) which I find greatly helps in planning out large bases that can be modularized logically & efficiently.

mrt144
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Vanilla mine/train/smelter strategies - what and why?

Post by mrt144 »

Malandark wrote:
Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:01 pm
Base Structure.jpg

I'm currently nearing 300 hours setting up my latest base, (have around 1,700 hours in total playing Factorio) all of which has been spent setting up my Iron and Copper Smelters and not much else other than providing enough power to test these out.

My approach to setting this base up is one based on the principles of a humble plant that in turn, becomes a pyramid.

As shown in the above screen shot (which is still under very heavy construction), I have built up a 'root' system from the bottom of my pyramid that is comprised of separate rail lines, each of these 'root' lines is dedicated to a particular resource. In the screen shot I have from left to right, The Coal line, Copper Line, Iron Line. Because each of these 'root' lines never connect directly to any other line the A.I pathing will never be able to find a shortcut that forces one resource supply train to cross over another. In past play-through's I have found it pays to scout for large patches of resources quite a distance away from the starting area, as shown in the above screen shot. I tend to only setup mining outposts on 15+Million ore plots as anything less will dry up quite quickly.

I have debated many times if it is better to setup mining outposts with on-site factories and while there is the added benefit of getting large amounts of compression from transported items going from mining outposts to the main base, having everything neatly and logically placed inside the main base wins every-time for me at least.

At the bottom of my 'base' I am setting up a whole chain of Iron/Copper drop-offs, smelters and collection points that will span across the bottom of my base, so all these supply trains will never clog up or use the rail lines the higher up my pyramid grows. As I need more smelters, they 'grow' horizontally outwards, copper expands to the left, Iron to the right. Having all these smelters at the bottom of my base keeps all my supply trains traffic manageable and close to my mining outposts.

Using a Rail Grid System is a must, after many hours of trail and error my preferred, overall train setup is L-CCCC (1 Loco, 4 Cargo Wagons) using a 2 rail (RHD) system. I am a great believer in K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid) which I find greatly helps in planning out large bases that can be modularized logically & efficiently.
A kindred Factorio spirit!

Post Reply

Return to “General discussion”