Requester Chest...

Post all other topics which do not belong to any other category.
Andir
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:38 pm
Contact:

Requester Chest...

Post by Andir »

Why are the requester chests buried under red/green/blue/gold/purple research when all other robotics can be had at red/green? What's the purpose of robots without requester chests?

BigBosun
Manual Inserter
Manual Inserter
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by BigBosun »

I also wonder why the useful logistic items are locked behind such a steep wall. I always utilize bots as soon as I possibly can and this change has really messed with my plans so far. I much prefer bots and large logistics networks to trying to work at perfectly balancing belts. Please either have the requester/active provider chest unlock with the rest of the chests or at most have blue packs be a requirement.

Andir
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Andir »

I'm actually totally behind putting them behind the blue research. This is how they were before.

hoho
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 677
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:23 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by hoho »

The new blue research is trivial compared to old one.

Being able to request stuff into chests is a majort gamechanger, similar to the level of getting trains or construction robots. I think having it behind a difficult research is justified.

Hannu
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 850
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 6:27 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Hannu »

I think that idea is to give personal construction bots first and logistic bots at later phase. I think it is good balance.

saturn7
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 89
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:14 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by saturn7 »

I like it that the no-logistic-network-phase lasts signficiantly longer. Previously, you only needed 150 or so blue science (easy to get if you know how to rush oil), and then you could use robots to automate everything. Now that step is significantly harder, but you can still use construction bots and logistic slots quite early.

ftbreizhbugs
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 40
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2016 11:09 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by ftbreizhbugs »

I am very bad at designing base and i was hoping to use the logistic system to start a new "clean" base avoiding as much thing as i can in my intermediate base but i cant because of that...
logistically bringing item to the character is a more a quality of life feature, but the requester chest is a feature that really affect the way we build the base and pushing it further down the tech tree disgust me to have to spend too much time building temporary infrastructure...
(the fact you cant choose/limit forest patch size on map creation really delay the time i really get into my "long term" base too..)
I think the fork to (full)logisitc research should happen at the same time you can choose red belt so either you can enhance your actual "belt base" or you can switch to "logisitc base". The running cost of (robotport / logistic bots) plus the power requirement is already high enough to justify giving this possibility sooner to the player?

Andir
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Andir »

ftbreizhbugs wrote:I am very bad at designing base and i was hoping to use the logistic system to start a new "clean" base avoiding as much thing as i can in my intermediate base but i cant because of that...
logistically bringing item to the character is a more a quality of life feature, but the requester chest is a feature that really affect the way we build the base and pushing it further down the tech tree disgust me to have to spend too much time building temporary infrastructure...
(the fact you cant choose/limit forest patch size on map creation really delay the time i really get into my "long term" base too..)
I think the fork to (full)logisitc research should happen at the same time you can choose red belt so either you can enhance your actual "belt base" or you can switch to "logisitc base". The running cost of (robotport / logistic bots) plus the power requirement is already high enough to justify giving this possibility sooner to the player?
Your post made me think that it would be interesting to have research branches like we have military. Having a "belt" branch that improves inserter speeds and belt related items and a "robotics" research branch with bot speed, carrying capacity, etc.

Artentus
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2016 8:16 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Artentus »

Imo it does make sense that it costs production science as the blue science is much easier now.
However, I don't think the hightech science is justified, it requires lategame items that I normally use bots for to produce. Blue circuits and modules are a real hassle to build with belts, so this just promotes messy factories.

hoho
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 677
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:23 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by hoho »

Artentus wrote:Blue circuits and modules are a real hassle to build with belts, so this just promotes messy factories.
Considering the MASSIVE energy use of bots, you're effectively changing having to belt in a ton of green circuits to building huge amounts of power production.

I generally have 2.5 belts worth of green + 0.5 belts of red circuits coming in to the line making blue circuits. It's not a perfect ratio but good enough.

Artentus
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2016 8:16 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Artentus »

Energy is not really a problem at this stage though. Even less so now that there is nuclear, which is reached around the same time you start to build production science, so it would be a perfect fit.

onebit
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 4:32 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by onebit »

The blue circuits pre-req doesn't make sense. Nothing related to bots uses blue circuits.

weltvagbund
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 1:06 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by weltvagbund »

I must say after running a new start in 0.15 that the requirements of all those different Tech Science Packs is very challanging for the Requester Chest. Even if you do the standard Oil Rush, you cant really be quick, due to the fact that you need additional blue Science to research the Electric Smelter, which gives you Production Science Packs.

I am strongly agreeing, that the Requester Chest should move behind only Red, Green and Blue Science.

By the Point where you automated Blue Science, everybody found out how belts move, and decided on a playstyle like Mainbus, Bots, or Spagetti. I found the Requirement so tideus, that i will propably never start a Vanilla Megabase again. It just feels abritrary and it takes a ton of work. I mean getting that Requester Chest doesent even make a Bot base. You still need all the resources to build the Chests and the Bots, and the Energy to keep it running. Putting it behind that requirement makes it not any longer a Mid Game Tech but a Late Game Tech.

fctorgore
Manual Inserter
Manual Inserter
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:29 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by fctorgore »

As far as I'm concerned the requester chest being effectively blocked till late end-game completely changes my gaming experience to the point it's broken. I think I'll go back to 0.14 till this is fixed.

User avatar
Deadly-Bagel
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1498
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:12 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Deadly-Bagel »

This is going to put a damper on my no-belts run...
Money might be the root of all evil, but ignorance is the heart.

Taszi
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:52 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Taszi »

There is a MOD, if you would like use requester chest as the old way.

User avatar
dog80
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 278
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 11:57 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by dog80 »

rush for blue science => all bots are done => wait... i need purple and yellow to get requester chests => fuck...

and also this is the true reason for bots, the automatic material delivery and dumping is just a *nice to have feature - actually not having to lay out infrastructure is the big thing here...

also because the frustration about 0.15 is somehow slowly but surely kicking in... everything seems so much slower and more boring now. i'd love to have in addition to the "advanced recipe" and "technology-cost-multiplier >= x1" an option which might be too silly as "easy recipes" and the possibility to go below 1 with the multiplier. (Also in addition to that, a smelting speed and crafting speed multiplier... so in general to have to do less repetitive building.)

+ the new minimap features are somehow cool and great, though until i can use them properly with bots, i need bots and there we are at the beginning point.

might be too early for judgments

+ did steam enginges get more expensive? takes ages to build them now... // what about "never change a running system" was anything wrong with the boiler energy before? - now it as well has the feeling... although its a minor thing, that it takes longer and i have to expand energy more often than before. - i could somehow get to blue science/bots!!! with propably 2-4 or sth i dont remember energy "lines" which was somehow fine, now its going into the direction of having to check it more often and having to expand it more repeatedly, but with each time, not beeing as effective as building one line as we were used to.. hmm poor new awesome boiler design. i like that though :)

Daid
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 7:42 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Daid »

One of the FFFs state that the developers wanted earlier "personal bots". My guess is that this is reflected in the 2 different stages of personal roboport, the easier and earlier access to modular armor. And the research towards bots being quite cheap, except for the requester chest.

I personally never really understood why they have the requester chest at all. For me, it's a game breaker. The game is mostly about the logistics of running a factory. Where you move stuff from A to B to get processed. With the requester chest, all A and B points get connected without any penalty other then needing a lot of logistic bots. And thus the game goes from "where do I route these belts, how do I move my stuff from A to B" to "more logistic robots"

So, lovers of bots, tell me, how does your game work for you? What is your challenge? I'm really curious. As just saying "the game is broken for me now" is hard to grasp from my view on the game.

(steam engines produce about twice the power compared to before. So them being expensive/slow to build isn't a huge issue)

Kelderek
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 250
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:04 pm
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Kelderek »

By the time I was ready for a proper logistic system in my game I had up to blue science and yellow science, but no purple yet. Not sure why I did it that way, but my progress led me to make the high tech science (yellow) before attempting to setup the production science (purple). I wanted logistics bots bad enough that I just threw down an assembler and a chest with ingredients to make the 150 items of each type needed to make the purple science packs so I could unlock the logistic system tech.

I would agree that this tech is now too late in the tree, it feels out of place, I would rather see it available earlier.

On a side note, I discovered that there are only 2 tech nodes that use yellow science without needing purple, so you really want to do purple before doing yellow as there is a lot more tech that uses red-green-blue-purple.

User avatar
Deadly-Bagel
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1498
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:12 am
Contact:

Re: Requester Chest...

Post by Deadly-Bagel »

Bots make the layout easier so you can spend the "difficulty" making more powerful layouts than possible with belts. For example you could squeeze in more beacons, or just make the overall base more compact. That's what I'm intending on doing anyway.
Money might be the root of all evil, but ignorance is the heart.

Post Reply

Return to “General discussion”