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Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:25 pm
by PUNISHER989
Fighting big bases has become a bit of a chore, only way is with the tank and laser turrets near by, the armour isn't really that great right now as they just swarm you, The shotty doesn't kill them quick enough,.

Any tips or tricks you guys have that can work?

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:30 pm
by PUNISHER989
I started off with big bases as the normal bases could just get rolled by the tank. But now I have to do drive bys with the tank, kill a spawner or two and scoot out of there to the nearby laser turrets i place.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:38 pm
by garath
Destroyer Capsules?

With follower Count 20, don't you get 143?

For me, I do this in my games:

Early Game - Heavy Armor, Submachine gun, Piercing Rounds
Mid Game - Tank with Piercing Rounds. I run over Medium Worms and Biter / Spitter bases with the tank, and I mop up with the tank machine gun (while also running them over with the tank).
End Game - Tank is useless, Shotgun... Well, I really don't want to get that close to the BIG worms. So, I use 6 exo skeletons to run at lightning speed around the outskirts of the enemy bases and let the 25-50 Destroyer robots do all the work. With upgraded damage, they are doing, I think 20 + 20 damage each.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 1:47 pm
by silverkitty23
garath wrote:With follower Count 20, don't you get 143?
134. Though really you maximally deploy 130 because otherwise you'd waste a bot (since a capsule deploys 5). You usually only get above 130 if you're replacing losses (i.e. once you've lost one to 129, a new capsule won't be waste anymore), but I'm usually too busy running and dropping poison caps to replace my losses until they get to <100.

With huge bases full of worms, I still die and reload a lot, too. The idea is to run "past" the base, dragging the biters/spitters away from the base *while killing as few of them as possible*, because the spawners won't make more until they're replacing casualties. That leaves the base exposed to concentrated attack of the spawners and worms. Once the base is dead, then you let the biters/spitters catch up and die to your bots.

...but with a ton of worms, you'll die anyway, so you run past the base, drop poison on all the worms, then maybe try to circle back, but depending on the closeness of other bases it's still pretty easy to die here. With Punisher's big station of turrets nearby, it would be a lot easier to rest there between passes at the base, but the whole point of destroyer caps is to be able to engage bases away from your power grid, imho, so I'm never really in that situation.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 2:16 pm
by raidho36
I just drag power supply line from nearby huge solar farm, and put laser turret blueprints closer and closer to the base. Robots quickly deploy laser turrets and constantly repair them, which in turn quickly destroy everything in vicinity - rinse and repeat. I then come back and deconstruct turrets that are way too far behind. Just make sure you have plentiful supply of laser turrets, power line poles, repair kits and construction robots. If you run out of any of these you'll have to retreat and in the process you'll also lose everything that was in any proximity to the enemy.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 4:28 pm
by starholme
It's not always an option of course, but it's amazing how much easier/more enjoyable clearing bases is with a friend.

We both run mk2 armor, two reactors, 3 exo, 1 nightvision, 5 batteries mk2, 1 roboport, rest shields mk2 (5 i think?). It's a little annoying with behemoths now, just because they take too long to kill, so we tend to bring a laser outpost nearby. We then trash the nearby bases, till we are bored of running so far/run out of poison/ammo.

The real reason it works better than when alone, is that player A goes past, tossing poison. Mobs aggro and chase him back to the turrets. Player B, who was 2 seconds behind A, trashes the spawners with a shotgun and drops more poison on worms until he has too many enemies pestering him. By now, player A should be on their way in. Player B heads for the turrets, Player A takes over trashing. I find that each pass (after the first, who just tossed some poison out) we can clear about 8 spawners + associated worms. Our world is almost a deathworld, just enough space that you can tell bases apart rather than a single blob.

The two of us havn't even bothered to start building capsules. We started work on a factory for them, just because we want to, not because we really need them. Maybe we'll get it running this weekend. Copper has been a scarce resource this world. RNG is not kind. Who the hell needs that much stone? We could concrete half the damn planet...

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 5:24 pm
by garath
Do I understand correctly that the biter / spitter spawner health is the same from the beginning of the game to the end game?

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 6:39 pm
by Kewlhotrod
garath wrote:Do I understand correctly that the biter / spitter spawner health is the same from the beginning of the game to the end game?
yeah homie

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 8:49 pm
by garath
Along with some other ideas, I think it might be interesting to make the spawn bases tougher later in the game. Compared to the HP of the Behemoth biters, their bases are paper thin, I think.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:39 pm
by bobucles
Honestly the game can be completed well before behemoth biters enter the picture. It requires heavy use of solar power and efficiency modules to cut down pollution. It doesn't even require that for crazy speed running.

Desert starts may seem easy to manage, but they're a curse in disguise. Trees absorb a remarkably large amount of pollution which will reduce the active biter threat.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:50 am
by PUNISHER989
Well to honest I haven't really experimented with the destroyer bots as right from the beginning i was struggling for resources as i was surrounded from the start,
not my 1st map by the way.
anyways, I'll give that a try.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:53 am
by bo6
It looks like your lasers need to kill a huge number of aliens before you can even get close to those bases (Unless if that picture you posted is defending against biter attack waves).

Have you tried a shock-tactic laser turret offensive? If you can punch a line of laser turrets through a base very quickly with construction drones you can usually destroy bases quickly enough to prevent too many biters/spitters from spawning.

The aliens will usually kill a few drones or even a laser turret or two, but it's very reliable at wiping out bases (as long as nobody 'accidentally' cuts your power).
LaserOff.jpg
LaserOff.jpg (142.1 KiB) Viewed 3370 times
Each phase consists of repeating laser arrays (usually much larger than the one I show here) that are placed the second the space is available:
laserarray.jpg
laserarray.jpg (35.64 KiB) Viewed 3370 times

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:04 pm
by PUNISHER989
It looks like your lasers need to kill a huge number of aliens before you can even get close to those bases (Unless if that picture you posted is defending against biter attack waves).

Have you tried a shock-tactic laser turret offensive? If you can punch a line of laser turrets through a base very quickly with construction drones you can usually destroy bases quickly enough to prevent too many biters/spitters from spawning.

The aliens will usually kill a few drones or even a laser turret or two, but it's very reliable at wiping out bases (as long as nobody 'accidentally' cuts your power).


Each phase consists of repeating laser arrays (usually much larger than the one I show here) that are placed the second the space is available:


That is just to get close to the base, the bases are massive. I do have a blueprint for the laser setup you see in the picture with an army of drones to build it fast.

So tower creeping hasn't worked, well, at a high cost.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:59 pm
by DerivePi
With exoskeletons and shields - drop a couple distractors near the swarm to pull them away.

While running in, continue to lay down distractors to keep the worms busy.

Shotgun the worms first and then the spawners while circling around.

Save ammo by staying ahead of the beasties and leading them back to a bank of turrets for clean up.

If shield level starts dropping rapidly, abandon this pass for another pass after recharging. Must leave early because enemy missiles will continue to track after leaving.

I don't use destroyers because they swing all over the place, but they are certainly an option. Just make sure you load up on them (50 or more at a time) and then pave a path of destruction through as many spawners as possible until they self destruct.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:28 am
by PUNISHER989
DerivePi wrote:With exoskeletons and shields - drop a couple distractors near the swarm to pull them away.

While running in, continue to lay down distractors to keep the worms busy.

Shotgun the worms first and then the spawners while circling around.

Save ammo by staying ahead of the beasties and leading them back to a bank of turrets for clean up.

If shield level starts dropping rapidly, abandon this pass for another pass after recharging. Must leave early because enemy missiles will continue to track after leaving.

I don't use destroyers because they swing all over the place, but they are certainly an option. Just make sure you load up on them (50 or more at a time) and then pave a path of destruction through as many spawners as possible until they self destruct.

Whats your opinion on grenades at this stage tho. is it worth throwing them while I spam the shotty?

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 1:57 pm
by JoaoBernardino
raidho36 wrote:I just drag power supply line from nearby huge solar farm, and put laser turret blueprints closer and closer to the base. Robots quickly deploy laser turrets and constantly repair them, which in turn quickly destroy everything in vicinity - rinse and repeat. I then come back and deconstruct turrets that are way too far behind. Just make sure you have plentiful supply of laser turrets, power line poles, repair kits and construction robots. If you run out of any of these you'll have to retreat and in the process you'll also lose everything that was in any proximity to the enemy.
This.

Extra power available, long power supply to the area you want and drop laser turrets like crazy... repeat...

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:48 pm
by starholme
PUNISHER989 wrote:
DerivePi wrote:With exoskeletons and shields - drop a couple distractors near the swarm to pull them away.

While running in, continue to lay down distractors to keep the worms busy.

Shotgun the worms first and then the spawners while circling around.

Save ammo by staying ahead of the beasties and leading them back to a bank of turrets for clean up.

If shield level starts dropping rapidly, abandon this pass for another pass after recharging. Must leave early because enemy missiles will continue to track after leaving.

I don't use destroyers because they swing all over the place, but they are certainly an option. Just make sure you load up on them (50 or more at a time) and then pave a path of destruction through as many spawners as possible until they self destruct.

Whats your opinion on grenades at this stage tho. is it worth throwing them while I spam the shotty?
In theory, it's an extra ~50dps (not taking into account resistances), but in reality it's such a tiny drop in the bucket. Better off spamming poison. Does 8/second, lasts for ~10 seconds(can't find the actual number offhand). Only downside is they don't touch spawners. Best use I find is for trashing worms.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:34 pm
by AutoMcD
+1 using poison to take down big worms is very helpful.
Use destroyers or whatever you have to take some heat off you, if you stop running just before the spawn camp they will slingshot past you and attract the abuse. Use these precious seconds to fumigate the area, then retreat to recharge shields while the poison does it's job. It works!

Even if you aren't directly using turret-creep technique, I would still make an outpost so that you have a "safe zone" to retreat to if you get mobbed. Turret creep is safest/easiest if simply expanding the base and need to clear an area. I use on-foot if it's small enough camp, remote, just clearing out the pullotion area.

I always use 2 exo so that I can outrun biters. Often can run circles while the destroyers pick them apart, pop off the shotty every now and then when you have enough of a lead.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2016 8:17 pm
by SpeedDaemon
DerivePi wrote: I don't use destroyers because they swing all over the place, but they are certainly an option.
That swinging is actually key to staying alive in bases with lots of worms. If you come in towards the base, and then pause just out of worm range, they'll go out in front of you and take virtually all the aggro, allowing you run in under them and shotgun the heck out of stuff. You still have to be really careful, not outrun them, and back off when you start to take hits though.

Re: Fighting Big bases.

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:03 pm
by OdinYggd
I'm still tank creeping for the most part.

So I drive around in the tank because I am squishy and don't like dying. And from the relative safety of the tank, perform turret creeping.

But my laser turrets are in a line- 6 turrets with a substation in the center. And they are cased in walls to shield them from the biters, although spitters can still damage them.

Like so I carry enough materials for at least 3 such deployments, but only put 2 of them down at any given time. And then I just keep creeping forward, the tank keeping me from getting squished while the laser turrets do all the work. Sometimes while waiting for the lasers to clean up a wave, I'll use the tank cannon to snipe at the spawners and try to pick out the spitter spawners in particular because those hurt a little.

My power line usually goes back to the 50MW generator at my main facility, so power has only been an issue when I accidentally ran over a pole and didn't notice till I was mid-creep. I do put out forward bases containing solar panels and accumulators as well, but these are only strong enough to defend a position. They won't hold power overnight when actively creeping.