Serious stuttering with vanilla game

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NineNine
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Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by NineNine »

I'm running no mods. Just a vanilla game. It ran fine until the last hour or so of game play. Now, game hangs every few seconds. No errors.

I have 7000 logistic and 9000 construction bots. I have maybe a hundred trains. My sciences are being produced at about 240/min and consumed at about 170/min. I went from 8 GB RAM to 64 GB RAM (to try to solve this problem), and I'm running a late model i7. Neither processor nor memory seem to be anywhere near maxxed out. No other applications are running at the time.
Factorio Problem 1.png
Factorio Problem 1.png (1.12 MiB) Viewed 2420 times
Factorio Problem 2.png
Factorio Problem 2.png (34.93 KiB) Viewed 2420 times
I don't know where a bottleneck might be that would cause this performance problem.

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BlueTemplar
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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by BlueTemplar »

These might help :
(accessed from F4)
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factorio_debug_time_usage.png
factorio_debug_time_usage.png (35.53 KiB) Viewed 2404 times
BobDiggity (mod-scenario-pack)

NineNine
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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by NineNine »

Thanks, but I don't know what to do with any of that information.

Did I maybe just reach the max of what Factorio can do?

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by Loewchen »

Check out: How to make a report - READ BEFORE POSTING and make sure to follow the instruction for Performance Issues linked within as well.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by mmmPI »

NineNine wrote:
Fri Feb 24, 2023 4:20 pm
Thanks, but I don't know what to do with any of that information.

Did I maybe just reach the max of what Factorio can do?
If you press F4 and select the options shown, some numbers will be displayed on your screen, it may help to diagnose the problem. Transmitting the save file would help too but given the screenshot it will be too big to be attached in the forum.


There are different "limits" or way to reach them using factorio on any hardware, but often time stuttering is not expected or can be avoided in favor of a smoother decrease in fps, say you loose 10% or 20%, but it doesn't feel like "stutter" which may indicate other problem. The numbers shown in game could help determine if something in the game is slowing down too much, say trains, that happens sometimes wich grid network, in which case there is a gameplay way of fixing things, or it could indicate something is wrong with the configuration, like drivers, or error occuring. For the second part to help diagnosis a log could be helpful, this describe where to find the logs files by default https://wiki.factorio.com/Application_d ... _directory

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by NineNine »

I read the "how to make a report" post, and enabled my UPS. My UPS is in the 45-50 range, so I think I just need a faster CPU, according to that post.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by SoShootMe »

NineNine wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 3:03 pm
I read the "how to make a report" post, and enabled my UPS. My UPS is in the 45-50 range, so I think I just need a faster CPU, according to that post.
Your original description and the word "stuttering" suggest your FPS/UPS (probably UPS) is varying significantly; is that the case? If so, this is where the debug overlays already mentioned (and in the post linked from the "How to make a report" one) come in: they should point to a more specific cause.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by BlueTemplar »

My base is extremely modded and got pretty big : I used to have stuttering when moving around and/or zooming out. After lowering sprite resolution from «High» (basically for UHD-1) to «Normal» (basically for FullHD), that specific issue went away, and the gameplay is smooth even though it's around 30-45 UPS (/60).

So, as mmmPI already said, «"stutter" [...] may indicate other problem» and another solution than having to get a faster CPU.
BobDiggity (mod-scenario-pack)

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by mmmPI »

It is also possible to use this mod https://mods.factorio.com/mod/GTTS

One can set the target UPS to 30 instead of the default 60, the mod will double most base speed in the game and update will only occur half of the time. This allow to play at lower fps, when the base is getting too big for the computer, while not having the game itself, like science, trains or biters becoming slow as when one doesn't use the mod.

It can also get rid of stutter or variation in UPS as the game is given more time to compute each frame which may be enough to smooth things out.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by NineNine »

BlueTemplar: That didn't help me, unfortunately.

mmmPI: That mod looks crazy. I'm scared to install it!

I think the best thing to do in this situation is just to get a new CPU.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by SoShootMe »

NineNine wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:54 am
I think the best thing to do in this situation is just to get a new CPU.
Your current CPU is fairly recent and decent for Factorio; I'm pretty certain the gain from this will be quite small. Extra cores aren't going to help, for example.

It's not obvious from the information you've provided why you would have performance problems. Perhaps something is hindering performance of Factorio on your computer, or perhaps there is something about the way the game runs your particular save causing it to perform unusually badly.

Try another computer (with sufficient RAM, I suggest at least 16GB) if you can. Share the save if you're happy and able to. Post screenshots with the debug information requested when the game is stuttering with your save (and if it varies, when it isn't). Or buy a faster CPU for perhaps a few hours more expansion.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by datarza »

SoShootMe wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 3:28 pm
NineNine wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:54 am
I think the best thing to do in this situation is just to get a new CPU.
Try another computer (with sufficient RAM, I suggest at least 16GB) if you can.
He has 64 GB, man...

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by datarza »

NineNine wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:54 am
BlueTemplar: That didn't help me, unfortunately.

mmmPI: That mod looks crazy. I'm scared to install it!

I think the best thing to do in this situation is just to get a new CPU.
You have to buy an CPU with 2GB cache per core at least, so wait 10 or 20 years when these kind of CPU will be introduced on the market, it is not a joke, Factorio is the first game in the world which is huge depends on CPU cache

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by lyvgbfh »

How many radars do you have?

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by SoShootMe »

datarza wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:55 am
SoShootMe wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 3:28 pm
Try another computer (with sufficient RAM, I suggest at least 16GB) if you can.
He has 64 GB, man...
Look at "Memory" in the Task Manager screenshot, man... :P

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by mmmPI »

NineNine wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:54 am
mmmPI: That mod looks crazy. I'm scared to install it!
I mostly use this GTTS mod on my laptop, i set it to have a target framerate of 30 fps and it does wonder on the temperature and battery, the images are only 30 fps but apart from that it feels the same when running or driving since those things are made faster in the same proportion as the target frame rate is lowered compared to 60fps. It is better to use with a new savegame because the fluids can act a little different. But you can also install the mod, load your save, try it, change the target frame rate or uninstall the mod and then reload the save if you didn't like it. The changes by the mod are made to the game prototypes, not to the save game, it's only when you launch the game with the mod active that the experience will be different. It will tell you the mod is missing if you save with the mod and reload without it, but you can ignore the message, as there will be no consequences, the game will be normal again as if the mod was never there, unlike other mods that add new entity or ressources this one only changes some values that are not changed when the mod is not there.

If the regular UPS of a game are going from 60 at best to 30 at worst, setting to 30 would make those variation disappear, there would be no more slowdown of the game, it may not work with stutter or mini freeze, depending on what causes them it may. Some value are recommended because they are better number for division, if you pick one a little lower than what you have it could do the trick.

Although if you wonder how people can get some thousands of science per minutes, i highly doubt it's due to their computer being 10x or 100x faster. There are more order of magnitude of effiency that can be achieved ingame by either designing the factory differently, using modules and beacons to increase the productivity of each entity, reducing train network complexity, studying ups-efficient design from the internet :) or not playing with expensive receipe and tons of biters ?
SoShootMe wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:25 pm
Look at "Memory" in the Task Manager screenshot, man... :P

I think it says 9.0/63.7 GB (14%) and 28% for CPU which to me indicate that going from 8=>64 was probably necessary for a savemap this large but wouldn't make me want to buy a "faster" cpu as you said woud only allow for only few hours of expansion. Rather i think improving the efficiency of the factory to produce more science with less CPU time is where most gain could be achieved.

A screenshot where instead of the UPS being visible, the "show-time-usage" setting is active would provide more informations as to which piece of the factory are responsible.

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Re: Serious stuttering with vanilla game

Post by datarza »

SoShootMe wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:25 pm
datarza wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:55 am
SoShootMe wrote:
Fri Mar 24, 2023 3:28 pm
Try another computer (with sufficient RAM, I suggest at least 16GB) if you can.
He has 64 GB, man...
Look at "Memory" in the Task Manager screenshot, man... :P
You must pass an eye exam

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