Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Regular reports on Factorio development.
boksiora
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 97
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016 7:45 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by boksiora » Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:49 pm

great update, cant wait to play it on a new base

Rseding91
Factorio Staff
Factorio Staff
Posts: 9978
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:23 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Rseding91 » Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:51 pm

Dev-iL wrote:On a different subject, I really started to notice the arbitrariness of shadow direction (see yellow lines in the image below), and it makes me somewhat uneasy. Can something be done about this?
Not without sacrificing performance by a large amount.
If you want to get ahold of me I'm almost always on Discord.

Triaxx2
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:06 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Triaxx2 » Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:53 pm

Looks more like the Starcraft Cliffs to me.

So, If I lay an underground on the top of the cliff and one on the bottom, will they connect?

On the other hand, I'm eagerly awaiting Modders to make me Rail bridges or rail ramps to run trains over them. (I know they're out there, I can hear them coding.)

imajor
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 163
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:02 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by imajor » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:03 am

ske wrote: I don't know how to feel about that. It just doesn't feel right. This is just like landfill. Very useful in certain situations but given enough resources it makes the whole map flat and void of features. Good for a sandbox where you copy-paste blueprints but it takes away from the challenge. I'd rather have landfill and cliff-explosives as a mod that needs to be enabled.
Completely agree with that. When you start a new game there should be an option where you could say you want undestructible/normal/non-existing clifs. I would also love to be able to play without landfill.

User avatar
Light
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 6:19 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Light » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:04 am

Elevation is one thing I've always felt was missing for some map variation and playstyle, so this is a step in the right direction for sure.

I know I won't be blowing up cliffs, since planning around them is more interesting than just removing them for more flat land. The world isn't so conveniently flat to allow such seamless construction, sometimes nature is the boss and you have to be creative to work around it. I look forward to seeing how people build their factories with cliffs around them beyond just defensive choke points.

Diablo
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 12:35 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Diablo » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:19 am

QQ: will this be a toggleble feature in the map generator options?

DerGraue
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 116
Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 12:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by DerGraue » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:49 am

QQ: will this be a toggleble feature in the map generator options?
I would like to know that as well and I really hope it will be toggleable.

I mean, they look nice and stuff, they might make the terrain look better, but really, I want to build and not click cliffs away :|

rkfg
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by rkfg » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:50 am

The terrain on the cliff must be different, not just a continuation of the "lower" part. On this picture it somehow gives away the underlying trick, i.e. there's no 3rd dimension at all:
fff-219-cliffs-05.jpg
fff-219-cliffs-05.jpg (123.42 KiB) Viewed 2019 times
It doesn't look right because in reality there are different natural forces affecting these areas for thousands of years so they can't look like the cliff has been simply extruded up five minutes ago. Because of that the 3D effect disappears and all I see is a weird fence made of thin and long rocks... However, if the terrain is noticeably different at the base of the cliff and above (like, the base is grassy and the cliff top is sandy or just brown, it could be vice versa as well), the effect is really cool and solid!

OBXandos
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 53
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:53 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by OBXandos » Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:34 am

I'm super excited about this! The cliffs look great and should add some great game play options without actually affecting balance overall.

Some suggestions I have would be to make the cliffs somehow able to be mined for either stone or landfill. We should also be able to use stone or landfill to create a ramp. The cliff explosives just seem like a bandaid fix. Making the cliffs able to be mined and/or modified opens up the possibility to have things like strip mines, underground tunnels, and all sorts of other options that are much more exciting than just blowing something up that gets in our way.

As for the new enemies people have suggested, I personally do not want any more enemies that serve no purpose other than annoying the player. If they gave resources, offered some sort of character experience, or gave some sort of quest or objective then I wouldn't mind. I feel the planet we play on offers enough resistance to the player already with its current enemies, resource sparseness, and now cliffs to navigate.

Keep up the great work everyone!
OBX

QGamer
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 177
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by QGamer » Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:45 am

I'm excited about the idea of terrain that is a bit more realistic, but...

"Cliff Explosives?"

First of all, there has to be a better name for that. Secondly, perhaps another idea would be to...
MeduSalem wrote:...mine the cliffs away... in a slow, but not too tedious, process which gives you stone in return of a flat surface...
Another thing: if ore is present on top of a cliff, mining the cliff should give the ore as well as stone.

If explosives are used to blow up a cliff, I think it should be somewhat exprensive and the resulting explosion scatters stone items along the ground for you to pick up.

Removing a cliff should also expose bare ground underneath (i.e. not grass or sand).

nljr
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 92
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 2:32 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by nljr » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:22 am

QGamer wrote: "Cliff Explosives?"

First of all, there has to be a better name for that.
I think, in real life, that sort of demolition uses something called "mining charges".


I kind of hope that whatever they are, they're not thrown, but instead installed.

Jap2.0
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 2048
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:02 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Jap2.0 » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:29 am

This is utterly amazing. It brings back so many old memories of AoE2. I almost want to put Factorio graphics into AoE2 now. It'd probably be pretty hilarious. I also have a few questions and comments:
  • 1. Will spitters be able to attack over cliffs? If not, cliffs are OP, but I'm assuming they'll be able to.
    2. I second (actually more like fourth or fifth) the idea to create ramps instead of destroying the cliffs.
    3. I also agree that terrain type should change from the top to the bottom of a cliff.
    4. @Rseding91 How would that hurt preformance? You'd simply need to redraw the shadows in the correct orientation, right? I realize it would be a major pain for the graphics team, but the preformance argument doesn't make sense.
    5. I need this. Please... ;'( my lack of patience is killing me.
There are 10 types of people: those who get this joke and those who don't.

User avatar
5thHorseman
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 777
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by 5thHorseman » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:50 am

rkfg wrote:The terrain on the cliff must be different, not just a continuation of the "lower" part. On this picture it somehow gives away the underlying trick, i.e. there's no 3rd dimension at all:
fff-219-cliffs-05.jpg
Agreed. That section looks less like a cliff and more like a primitive wall of rocky spears.
"So you completed the game with a spaghetti factory? Well I hand crafted a rocket and threw it into space with my bare hands!"

User avatar
The_Mtn_Dew_Master
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2017 4:31 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by The_Mtn_Dew_Master » Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:25 am

Would cliffs work on old saves?

Because if they did then wouldn’t peoples old factories be cut in half
It will take some time to decide what my signature will be...

Loewchen
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 5474
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 5:53 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Loewchen » Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:53 am

The_Mtn_Dew_Master wrote:Would cliffs work on old saves?

Because if they did then wouldn’t peoples old factories be cut in half
I assume they will be discovered with map exploration, the already explored part of the map will not be changed when loading a 0.15 game in 0.16.

amijlee
Manual Inserter
Manual Inserter
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:12 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by amijlee » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:18 am

So when you blow up a cliff does it make a new cliff? Or does the explosion magically match the z-levels? Or make a rubble-free ramp? I think it would be better if you had to dig out a cliff if you want to flatten a z-level, which would produce landfill and move the cliff back.

deer_buster
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 101
Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2016 3:35 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by deer_buster » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:27 am

Umm, rail spans between cliffs a thing now? please? Exciting times...

User avatar
Tomik
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 210
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by Tomik » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:35 am

Okay. Idea time:

You could create upwards platforms, with a recipe for a Platform Block being concrete and steel beams and landfill blocks.Something like from StarCraft. Basically artificial cliffs and only for building on top of the 0-ground level. Not below it.

Image

You should also have explosives excavate the cliffs (or your own artificial platforms) away..OR..if you use the explosives on a 0-ground-level tile..you would get lakes/seas/water.

Finally: Add into the game seaborne and airborne enemies. That should prevent the players from going wild with Sea- and/or Cliff/Platform-Walls like players did with Sea-Walls in some modded Let's Plays on youtube.
Image

User avatar
aRatNamedSammy
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 216
Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 4:26 pm
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by aRatNamedSammy » Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:28 am

nice job on terrain :D
does projectile weapons will get a bonus from elevated areas? or extended view? any "regular" bonus we usualy have from higher position, as in real life or games :lol:
Teeth for Two (so sorry my bad english)

hoho
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 673
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:23 am
Contact:

Re: Friday Facts #219 - Cliffs

Post by hoho » Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:41 am

Triaxx2 wrote:Looks more like the Starcraft Cliffs to me.
That was my first thought as well.

Would be interesting if similar damage/visibility modifiers also applied as in SC :)

Post Reply

Return to “News”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: DaleStan, Google [Bot]