Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Regular reports on Factorio development.
GeoStyx
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by GeoStyx » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:41 pm

Pe334 wrote:Are their any plans to integrate somthing like Teamspeak in this game or an integrated Teamspeak-Overlay?
Just use Discord?
I use Discord for everything, even games that have voip built in.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Zeblote » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:27 pm

cva wrote:Hi,
at your image:
Image
Is there a bug on the right side in the middle? Why do the two pipes not connect? Was there some change too?

cva
This is obviously a sneak peek of a new feature that lets you precisely connect pipes :D

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by GewaltSam » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:28 pm

glex wrote:
cva wrote:Hi,
at your image:
Pipes.png
Is there a bug on the right side in the middle? Why do the two pipes not connect? Was there some change too?

cva
: )

This is a preview, it's aimed to show all the positions of the pipes,
no bugs, no worries. (yet?)
If you guys could find a good way to enable placing two pipes adjacent to each other without them connecting, I would be so happy :shock:

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Zeblote » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:31 pm

Image

The gear doesn't loop properly, it teleports every time it connects to the other one.

It's probably just the gif missing a few frames though :D

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by jcranmer » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:34 pm

... replacing a centrifugal pump graphic with a piston pump? But centrifugal pumps give so much better flow rates!

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by aubergine18 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:40 pm

This didn't change since it was added in December 2012. And it worked well, until people started making combinator contraptions with 40,000 lamps and 6,000 combinators, slowing down the game significantly.
Like justarandomgeek's Factorio computer?
These past weeks Albert has been working on a new 2x1 pump, which will replace the current 1x1 pump for pipes, which will also be used for filling the fluid wagon at the station.
The new pumps look awesome, I love the sort of industrial steam punk design. However, it's not very clear to me which direction they are pumping in just by looking at the pumps themselves - I have to look at the fluid flow in pipes to really be sure about the direction of fluid flow. Also, the fluid in the pipes looks like it's moving faster than the pumps are pumping it... Is there anything that can be done to tweak those things?
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Every connected entity that has signals to send would sent the signals every game tick.
Very glad to see that the circuit network performance has been improved! Now we just need to ensure that mods aren't changing values every tick (maybe there can be a check in API to see if value is different from current value and if not then don't trigger an update?)
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Deadly-Bagel » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:52 pm

I'm getting "Internal server error" trying to load FF =(
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by tacgnol » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:52 pm

Deadly-Bagel wrote:I'm getting "Internal server error" trying to load FF =(
same here.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by aubergine18 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:52 pm

Deadly-Bagel wrote:I'm getting "Internal server error" trying to load FF =(
It's intermittent error - try again in few mins...
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Alekthefirst » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:10 pm

Mengmoshu wrote:What will happen if I have the current 1x1 pumps in a save when I update to whatever version contains the 1x2 pumps? I'm hoping for something like leaving the old entity in until the player removes it, and dropping the new pump when they do.
Probably the same as when turrets got bigger

Everything stays where it is and work as it used to, but it looked messed up
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by aubergine18 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:21 pm

Why not keep the 1x1 pump, but make it underpowered and have it as early game pump? The bigger pump could then be more powerful, but perhaps require electricity or something to make it work?
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Deadly-Bagel » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:42 pm

Small pump requires electricity...

But yeah I usually put a pipe before any splits from liquid storage of any kind, and even between liquid storages if applicable. This allows me to, if necessary, drop a pump there to either limit the system or drain it so I can remove it without waste. The bigger pumps are now going to require I leave a 2 pipe gap =(
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by sabriath » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:51 pm

I suggest keeping the 1x1 pump and add the 2x1 at 60 fluid/sec or more rate.

Also, any way to allow pipes connectivity to circuit network to output flow rate and allow/block on signal? Annnnnd....temperature on circuit network.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by AssaultRaven » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:08 pm

There is potential for confusion if you display what is apparently a positive displacement pump but keep the same flow mechanics, since a positive displacement pump has comparatively-constant flow rate for non-compressible fluids compared to the centrifugal pumps used before.

Image

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by aubergine18 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:13 pm

sabriath wrote:I suggest keeping the 1x1 pump and add the 2x1 at 60 fluid/sec or more rate.
That would be awesome as we could connect a couple of offshore pumps to a single 2x1 pump and then follow on to drive a whole bunch of boilers and steam engines in a massive power station setup.
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by Tilendor » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:27 pm

One thing I would request, but without a useful recommendation, is to make fluid flow rate more discoverable.

You can easily visualize the flow of items on a belt, you can see them, count them(in theory), and tell if its a full compression on not.

Pipes are opaque. You can see the numbers on the info pane on the right when selecting a pipe, but I think a lot of people miss that fluid flow degrades with distance, and that multiple pumps are required to achieve highest flow. I watch several youtubers play, and they all seem ignorant of this. They have long runs of pipe without pumps, and mostly rely on the storage tanks to make up for this, as they are the only really decent way to measure fluid flow.

I usually try to offer an idea along side a request so I'm not expecting others to just magically fix it.

The only thing I can think of is a new pipe entity called a gauge. It's 1x1 and fluids flow through it. It contains a gauge( like a needle over measurements, like a mechanical speedometer) that measures the flow rate and moves the needle. You'll have to go out of your way to place these, you won't see the flow at every square like you do with a belt. Even so, just the inclusion into the game will expose the concept to users, let them play with it, learn from it, and educate users.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by aubergine18 » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:28 am

@Tilendor you can see the flow rate by speed of bubbles in the pipe windows, and the "fullness" of the pipe based on how much of the pipe window is filled with fluid. Although in some pipe layouts, particularly with junctions and underground connections, the pipe windows aren't shown so it probably needs something extra in "alt mode".
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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by zebediah49 » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:48 am

Three of my own thoughts on the pump --

1. The art is fantastic; that fits beautifully in the Factorio aesthetic.
2. I, too, am somewhat concerned by the lack of a simple 1x1 option. Currently the small pump is a booster, checkvalve, switch, and tank emptier (and possibly more). I would at least like a way of doing switching and checkvalving in a 1x1 space; 1x2 will make quite a few things awkwardly larger.
3. Please, PLEASE make it look constant flow rate when it is running at a constant flow rate. The preview animation really looks like it should not be providing a smooth fluid flow. Also the jerky motions of the pistons don't match the constant gear rotations. My personal preference would be for the two pistons to be exactly opposite, but I would be happy with anything that looked consistent.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by repler » Sat Sep 10, 2016 1:15 am

I love Factorio! Thank you for all your hard work.

Regarding collaborative multiplayer scenarios:
I had a hard experience getting started, despite having completed single player.
I want to give you a list here because I saw it with fresh eyes, these are not necessarily complaints or criticisms.

Here's what happened:
[early experience]
- I did not know how to use chat - no instructions given.
- I did not know there were teams.
- I did not know what team I was on.
- I did not know there were goals.

[later experience]
- I don't know how to see other teams progress towards goal. Are we ahead, behind, close?
- When I chat: is it to my team only, or all teams?
- Who is on my team? I see people walking near me, they must be on the team.

[things I was able to figure out]
- free electricity! yay! I still see people make steam engines, though.
- put things on the belt next to the free electricity to get goal points


Now that I have these things figured out I can't wait to play more multiplayer scenarios! It is a great deal of fun, as you know.
Honestly, not knowing how to chat was probably the biggest obstacle because it took no less than 3 google searches to get the answer.
After that I could bug my teammates and be clumsy trying to figure things out.

Second biggest after that is teams/team colors. It's not clear at all from the UI what is going on in the match. Nothing is labeled or color coded currently.
Also, I am red/green color blind so it is not easy to look at little pixels of my player to figure out the team.

Okay maybe you know all this stuff, but I wanted to share my first impression. Maybe other people are having the same troubles.
I hope this is helpful! I greatly enjoy the game and appreciate all your hard work.

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Re: Friday Facts #155 - Settling into fall

Post by KatherineOfSky » Sat Sep 10, 2016 2:01 am

Wow, the new pipes and pump look absolutely stunning! Can't wait to see them in-game!
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