Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

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slpwnd
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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by slpwnd »

bobingabout wrote:Your central server thing. A to S to B, B to S to A.... This is the stuff I was trying to tell you to do back in 0.11 when everyone tried to argue that it wasn't possible with Factorio. Central server system instead of Peer to Peer.
Yeah, there has been quite some confusion between using the peer-to-server for communication vs. using the peer-to-server state model. The latter is not possible with Factorio - it is still effectively peer-to-peer state model but with the communication being optionally routed via the server.

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by Venatos »

so.... are dedicated servers a thing now? i could get my old 2ghz dualcore out and let it run 24/7 for my peers. ;)

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by happymoep »

Using Factorio in education? Awesome!

The Minecraft-mod ComputerCraft posted information on its new ComputerCraftEdu program last month as well.
I really like the development of using games that way.
For you guys it might at least provide a little free promotion, though I bet you even get a motivational boost from seeing in what other ways people can benefit from your creation. It adds even more purpose to your efforts than "just" entertainment (of thousands of people ;) )


Background image:
Many people said that the new image looks gray-ish. May I remind you that the 0.11 background was pure grayscale?
I actually like that about the new image. The overall style is gray which reflects the pollution corrupting the planet and on the other hand there are these strong colorful highlights which break the monotony. After all the factory is still a vivid place with all the moving transport belts, robotic arms or robots flying around.
Veylon wrote:To pick the least important thing to talk about: on the subject of that picture, it's nicely made but there's no focus. It's a random chunk of factory floor doing God knows what. There's no sense of scale or purpose.

Imagine looking at the horizon. There's an enormous rocket assembly blotting a good chunk of it out. The sky back there is gray with black plumes of smoke rising into and merging with it. Between us and that mammoth building stretches an industrial wasteland. Further away it's a blur, but the nearer parts are belts bringing various items away into the background. The further belts would have finished items like pieces of machinery and the nearer ones have metal plates. There would be robot arms putting things into and taking them out of factories, showing us a progression. Nearest to us would be a wall lined with guns. Maybe there could be a train going through it via a gate loaded up with ore of some kind. On our side of the wall would be a patch of bare earth with a few dying trees on it and alien monsters attacking.
So, I like the new image, but after reading this post I imagine something even better. I'm not an artist but it sounds quite inspiring. Could you maybe just make a draft of it Veylon?


@Factorio Staff
Thanks for the frequent updates these days :)

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by MeinAccount »

If the climate is anything like at home in south Germany, you should definitely consider getting yourself an air conditioning! :) It is not as expensive as most would guess. (OK, I have no clou about cooling multiple rooms)
Leaving the office is something you might no longer want to do! :D (Meaning more Factorio updates for us)

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by happymoep »

Venatos wrote:so.... are dedicated servers a thing now? i could get my old 2ghz dualcore out and let it run 24/7 for my peers. ;)
You might want to check out https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... ultiplayer. There is some information on "Headless Server post 0.12.0"

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by kovarex »

Venatos wrote:so.... are dedicated servers a thing now? i could get my old 2ghz dualcore out and let it run 24/7 for my peers. ;)
The server still needs to be powerful enough to simulate the game.

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by wwdragon »

*floats by on inner-tube, squeaking a rubber ducky*

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by Venatos »

kovarex wrote: The server still needs to be powerful enough to simulate the game.
happymoep wrote: You might want to check out https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... ultiplayer. There is some information on "Headless Server post 0.12.0"
i only played factorio on a 4ghz octo-core, so im not sure what it needs, but i think i can get the old dualcore up to 3ghz with some tinkering. ;)

thnx for the link! awesome that there is no gpu required, i left the old rig with just some onboard gpu.

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by dofidjo »

Hi,
This is my 1st post on the forum :)
I'm a math teacher in France, in a private high school, so we have more flexibility regarding the programs, i'm already using factorio for teaching purposes!
We used various programs as an introduction to programming, logic/optimization thinking but since January of this year my classes are training on your awesome game, friday afternoon is factorio time! (from 2 to 6) and it's the 1st time where ALL the students are really into it, with the previous programs they used to see it as an afternoon where we just don't do math and use computers instead. Now they discuss it on their free time and a lot of them (about 10 out of my class of 23) play the game on a regular basis!
Each friday is dedicated to an exercise where they play in pairs trying to achieve a goal I've previously set, it can be for example from a box of iron and copper plates trying to output smart inserters in the tiniest space, output plastic from crude oil without underground pipes,...
At the end of the exercise the 5 best teams show theirs designs and try to explain their thought process (after 2 hours) and we then switch to freeplay for 90 mins where the goal is to run a main bus with the most "elegant" design possible, where they use the same map each week.
The parents are also very receptive to the idea once i've shown them what the game is about and I think the students really gain a lot of skills from this like reasoning, prioritizing, team communication,... And math stuff too :D (some students have shown awesome results regarding energy optimization during a difficult exercise)
Well that's all, thanks a lot for a great game, maybe i'll post some pictures of the class struggling when schools starts again!

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by Mr. Thunder_Tw »

dofidjo wrote:Hi,
This is my 1st post on the forum :)
I'm a math teacher in France, in a private high school, so we have more flexibility regarding the programs, i'm already using factorio for teaching purposes!
We used various programs as an introduction to programming, logic/optimization thinking but since January of this year my classes are training on your awesome game, friday afternoon is factorio time! (from 2 to 6) and it's the 1st time where ALL the students are really into it, with the previous programs they used to see it as an afternoon where we just don't do math and use computers instead. Now they discuss it on their free time and a lot of them (about 10 out of my class of 23) play the game on a regular basis!
Each friday is dedicated to an exercise where they play in pairs trying to achieve a goal I've previously set, it can be for example from a box of iron and copper plates trying to output smart inserters in the tiniest space, output plastic from crude oil without underground pipes,...
At the end of the exercise the 5 best teams show theirs designs and try to explain their thought process (after 2 hours) and we then switch to freeplay for 90 mins where the goal is to run a main bus with the most "elegant" design possible, where they use the same map each week.
The parents are also very receptive to the idea once i've shown them what the game is about and I think the students really gain a lot of skills from this like reasoning, prioritizing, team communication,... And math stuff too :D (some students have shown awesome results regarding energy optimization during a difficult exercise)
Well that's all, thanks a lot for a great game, maybe i'll post some pictures of the class struggling when schools starts again!
I love this sort of innovations/news.
my Mod: ThunderGui

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by kovarex »

dofidjo wrote:Hi,
This is my 1st post on the forum :)
I'm a math teacher in France, in a private high school, so we have more flexibility regarding the programs, i'm already using factorio for teaching purposes!
We used various programs as an introduction to programming, logic/optimization thinking but since January of this year my classes are training on your awesome game, friday afternoon is factorio time! (from 2 to 6) and it's the 1st time where ALL the students are really into it, with the previous programs they used to see it as an afternoon where we just don't do math and use computers instead. Now they discuss it on their free time and a lot of them (about 10 out of my class of 23) play the game on a regular basis!
Each friday is dedicated to an exercise where they play in pairs trying to achieve a goal I've previously set, it can be for example from a box of iron and copper plates trying to output smart inserters in the tiniest space, output plastic from crude oil without underground pipes,...
At the end of the exercise the 5 best teams show theirs designs and try to explain their thought process (after 2 hours) and we then switch to freeplay for 90 mins where the goal is to run a main bus with the most "elegant" design possible, where they use the same map each week.
The parents are also very receptive to the idea once i've shown them what the game is about and I think the students really gain a lot of skills from this like reasoning, prioritizing, team communication,... And math stuff too :D (some students have shown awesome results regarding energy optimization during a difficult exercise)
Well that's all, thanks a lot for a great game, maybe i'll post some pictures of the class struggling when schools starts again!
That sounds really great! My (soon to be) wife is a math teacher, and she likes to explore some new ways to teach math, like the hejny method: http://www.h-mat.cz/en, which is really interesting and I recommend it.
She was quite sceptical, when I told her Factorio can be used too, but I might change her mind :)

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by Husky »

Using Factorio for education purposes sounds fantastic, but I hope that doesn't mean you are going to streamline the gameplay geared towards engineer students. >.<
If this is the case, you might have to release two versions of Factorio, one for schools and one for gamers, just my two cents.

Regarding the picture, you have one that was colored all the way through, and I think using the one that is colored is better than the current one because the current looks unfinished. Overall, the game is coming along nice .. !

https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-96
um, hi . .

Image[url=steam://friends/add/76561198042109811]Image[/url]

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by dofidjo »

That sounds really great! My (soon to be) wife is a math teacher, and she likes to explore some new ways to teach math, like the hejny method: http://www.h-mat.cz/en, which is really interesting and I recommend it.
She was quite sceptical, when I told her Factorio can be used too, but I might change her mind :)
Thanks for the principles! I try to apply most of them already but I'll definitely look into it!
You cannot teach math with factorio but logic and reasoning and an introduction to programming
If this is the case, you might have to release two versions of Factorio, one for schools and one for gamers, just my two cents.
No! the students want a game! Put "edu" next to it and their attention span shortens! At least that's how I see it

I'm trying to look for other teachers in Paris that are teaching through gaming and I've heard of a microeconomy teacher using eve online for its 101 class <3

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by slpwnd »

dofidjo wrote:
That sounds really great! My (soon to be) wife is a math teacher, and she likes to explore some new ways to teach math, like the hejny method: http://www.h-mat.cz/en, which is really interesting and I recommend it.
She was quite sceptical, when I told her Factorio can be used too, but I might change her mind :)
Thanks for the principles! I try to apply most of them already but I'll definitely look into it!
You cannot teach math with factorio but logic and reasoning and an introduction to programming
If this is the case, you might have to release two versions of Factorio, one for schools and one for gamers, just my two cents.
No! the students want a game! Put "edu" next to it and their attention span shortens! At least that's how I see it

I'm trying to look for other teachers in Paris that are teaching through gaming and I've heard of a microeconomy teacher using eve online for its 101 class <3
This sounds very good. Maybe you guys could start a subboard / thread on the forum for sharing ideas and custom maps that you use in the classes.

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by happymoep »

slpwnd wrote:This sounds very good. Maybe you guys could start a subboard / thread on the forum for sharing ideas and custom maps that you use in the classes.
Great idea, imho. I'm not a teacher, I'd just like to try some puzzles/assignments out of curiosity, but it seems there are people who could really put it to use.

@dofidjo
Would you post some of your assignments for others to try?

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by CarlooSR »

dofidjo wrote:
I'm trying to look for other teachers in Paris that are teaching through gaming and I've heard of a microeconomy teacher using eve online for its 101 class <3

ohh eve <3 my secret love... i can imagine why this teacher in paris uses eve aka spreadsheet in space:D


But i wanted to say something about the graphic...
I as a soon to be architect, i like perspectives if they are good... this one ... could be better i guess.
Veylon said some important points, if this should be a scenic of a factory (not ingame footage) there should be a horizon to give the eye of the viewer something to hold on to.
if you turn the camera angle down ( the position of the viewer gets lower to the ground )you create depth in a picture which is so much more pleasent for the eye.
another thing bugging me about the picture is the smoke.
its just too much (atleast for me), you got all these nice graphics of buildings in HD why do you hide them in smoke so much? a little bit is cool but when you look at the picture and the first this you notice is the smoke everywhere, someone might get the impression of the game as a fire station simulator (jk, but its really to much)

the oil refinery in the middle of the picture serves as the main attraction, just because of its placement, cant you move it to the right so it appears more in the golden ratio ? you could cut away the steamengines and add a wildlife area to the left.
veylons idea of showing the biters and walls as well are super, this would intensify the struggle between the player and the enviroment...let a wall with shooting lasers crash right through the image. factory on one side, deep jungle on the other ( i am thinking of some Avatar-like jungle here!!)

the empty belts and emtpy inserters are not like a well running factory should look like...

these points may seem to critise the whole image and some may be my own opinion,but like this, the picture (and the game,when its advatised with it on greenlight) looks kind of boring(despite many things happen).
and remember less is more sometimes...

Greetings Carlos

Ps :all typos are due to a 14 hour projectwork.. I am a little bit sorry^^

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by harvald »

I have come to three ideas about educational aspects of Factorio.

I love idea of some sort of robot wars, but not in form of big explosions, but rather challenges of two A.I.'s. Factorio is big semi-automated factory and you are working on logic gates and ways of programming things. In some way this could be seen as one, big artificial organism. I can imagine a challenge between two players programming two logic networks. Same sets of resources, same time, maybe some components of factories already in the place, and the winner would be who could develop more efficient way to do some task.
Bigger dream is to see two factories which are trying to "overwrite" one each other. Somewhat like cancer uses cells of host organism. So then enemy would be environment (native inhabitants) but also other players with theirs factories. Efficient way then could be only way, because other player would not be as forgiving as limited AI of monsters. Educational aspect is that "war" would not mean shotting but thinking about strategies, programming, planning of future actions.

Third way i was thinking is using impact on environment, nature to show "cause and effect". How wind could propagate pollution, how organisms could be affected, how effects of pollution could reach far into the future, how short time planning is good now, but destructive in future.

What do you think about that?


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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by abregado »

wow! Im really excited that there are so many people interested in using video games for learning. Im back in Frankfurt now and have started work on a whole bunch of new content for Invent the World.

If anyone wants to meet in Hangouts, Skype or in real life to discuss the possibilities please do PM me. Unlike normal business, the more knowledge sharing we do the sooner we can make videogames in the classroom mainstream.

I also like to travel. If you are in europe hit me up and I can come visit :) If at all possible Id love to get involved with some european classes!

You can contact me via ben@inventtheworld.com.au or abregado82@gmail.com for Hangouts

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Re: Friday Facts #99 - MP forwarding

Post by RMJ »

Now you ruined it.

Now i cannot play factorio in 2d sprites anymore. Now i need Factorio 3D DirectX 12 hacked in windows 7. Because who wants to run windows 10 yuck.

But that looks amazing. sadly our computers would probably never be able to handle it.

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