IR in 0.18

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ukezi
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IR in 0.18

Post by ukezi »

It seems to me like deadlock abandoned the mod and doesn't want to port it to 0.18. As he published under no derivatives nobody else can publish a ported variant. However how is the licence situation about instructions to do it yourself? Because I just largely ported it and it's quite easy.

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ZombieMooose
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by ZombieMooose »

You can do anything for private use only. I can't recall any license objecting to that.
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by ukezi »

ZombieMooose wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 7:03 pm
You can do anything for private use only. I can't recall any license objecting to that.
I know that I can do it for my self and that I can't publish a patch but how about instructions to change it yourself? I suppose I could do it more general.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Dixi »

Short answer: Merely changing the format never creates a derivative.
Changing format to be compatible with 0.18 is not a forbidden change.


"no derivatives" means you can't publish after changing something in his mod gameplay features or balance, like allowing productivity modules for many intermediate products, as I did for myself, by adding a line "productivity = true," to code/data/components.lua, for a lot of item groups. As you see published modified version is a violation of his license, but explaining what I did, or posting a file that do those modification - is not.

I've checked IR licence https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/
License text is more oriented on media, not programs, nether addons.
In our case, phrase "Merely changing the format never creates a derivative.", could be read as "change format to be compatible with Factorio v xxx".
Also mind "No additional restrictions".

You can post fixed to 0.18 version, as long as you refer to original IR, and change nothing else except compatibility.

If you still afraid to do it, you can publish any guide or a ready patch to fix IR mod.

This action is never forbidden even in much more strict EULA of many commercial games. In later case using/applying that patch is formally forbidden, but that is a responsibility of a person, who bought the game and is applying a patch, not the one who made or published it. For practical application - check any nude mod portal :-)

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Bilka »

Dixi wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 9:37 am
Short answer: Merely changing the format never creates a derivative.

I've checked IR licence https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/
License text is more oriented on media, not programs, nether addons.
In our case, phrase "Merely changing the format never creates a derivative.", could be read as "change format to be compatible with Factorio v xxx".
Also mind "No additional restrictions".
The license text https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by ... /legalcode does not contain the text you quote. The license text does however contain the following: "Adapted Material means material subject to Copyright and Similar Rights that is derived from or based upon the Licensed Material and in which the Licensed Material is translated, altered [...]" and "[T]he Licensor hereby grants You a [...] license to exercise the Licensed Rights in the Licensed Material to:
[...]
produce and reproduce, but not Share, Adapted Material for NonCommercial purposes only."
I'm an admin over at https://wiki.factorio.com. Feel free to contact me if there's anything wrong (or right) with it.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Dixi »

Bilka wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:27 am
The license text does not contain the text you quote.
I took the text from a short form of Licence.
I still think minor modifications, to be compatible with a new version, is closer to "format", then to "adaptation".

In case that we decide that it's an adaptation, one still free to publish his script and guide how to change IR mods to be compatible with 0.18. And this will be a good thing, so everyone will not do the same job of researching what need to be changed.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by eradicator »

ukezi wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:07 pm
Because I just largely ported it and it's quite easy.
The big breaking changes haven't happend yet.

Has he officially declined to hand it over to another maintainer like he did with the stacking beltboxes?
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Repairmanski »

ukezi wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:07 pm
... I just largely ported it and it's quite easy.
Did you have to do anything with furnaces? After I ported everything (that threw errors) it appears that the only steel-age (arc) furnaces that are functioning were active at the time of rollup to 0.18. None of the others seem to accept input except manually.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by ukezi »

eradicator wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 4:35 pm
ukezi wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:07 pm
Because I just largely ported it and it's quite easy.
The big breaking changes haven't happend yet.

Has he officially declined to hand it over to another maintainer like he did with the stacking beltboxes?
He just vanished, set the mod to depreciated and had the thread closed.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by ukezi »

Repairmanski wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 8:26 pm
ukezi wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:07 pm
... I just largely ported it and it's quite easy.
Did you have to do anything with furnaces? After I ported everything (that threw errors) it appears that the only steel-age (arc) furnaces that are functioning were active at the time of rollup to 0.18. None of the others seem to accept input except manually.
For me it all works as expected. I would try to reset the recipes. Also are the outputs full?

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Repairmanski »

Yeah I tried that too. Deconstructed, pasted, rebuilt, nada. It is probably an interaction with something else. I'll figure it out. Thanks for getting back to me!

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Jap2.0 »

Anyone know if/when this would be considered abandonware?

(If it would be, it wouldn't be until 0.18 was stable at least, and may also depend on whether Deadlock reappears or not.)
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by DaveMcW »

Jap2.0 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:58 am
Anyone know if/when this would be considered abandonware?
Copyright expires 70 years after the author dies. "Abandonware" is just another word for piracy.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by darkfrei »

DaveMcW wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:54 am
Jap2.0 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:58 am
Anyone know if/when this would be considered abandonware?
Copyright expires 70 years after the author dies. "Abandonware" is just another word for piracy.
Old computer Atari has own software, some of them are about 50 years old. Why the copyright protects it?

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by ZombieMooose »

DaveMcW wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 6:54 am
Copyright expires 70 years after the author dies. "Abandonware" is just another word for piracy.
Abandonware means the original copyright onwer has refused or failed to enforce their copyright.

Copyright has to be specifically enforced or it can go into public domain.

That's why Nintendo goes after fan works.
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by eradicator »

ZombieMooose wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:30 am
Copyright has to be specifically enforced or it can go into public domain.
Untrue in most jurisdictions. Their heirs could sue you after 50 years just fine (for any violation that isn't time-barred). See the first paragraph on wiki:
Wikipedia on Abandonware wrote: Although such software is usually still under copyright, the owner may not be tracking copyright violations.
For the specific case of IR @Deadlock has *explicitly* stated several times that he has no intent whatsoever to enforce his copyright claims. So by your "definition" IR was abandonware from the day it was released. (And btw most other mods on the portal also.)
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Deadlock989 »

Less than a fortnight, and already the buzzards are circling the carrion. I wish all this shit-stirring would stay confined to Reddit and Discord where it belongs.

The mod works perfectly well in the stable branch of Factorio. It is, as far as I'm concerned, a finished piece. Given that 0.18.0 appears to be the most pointless update in Factorio's history, it's not exactly onerous to stay on the stable branch for a few weeks longer while you finish your saved games.

For the record: the license is staying exactly as it is, until the mod portal server is turned off. The mod is my work, and it was a lot of work.

I might have handed it over to someone else to look after and maybe adapt further if I could have identified someone who meets all of these criteria: someone who actually bothered to ask; someone with the technical ability and ideally a track record in maintaining half-decent Factorio mods; someone who has the same or similar vision for the mod's balance and mechanics; someone who actually has the time and motivation to do it; someone who isn't going to be a dick about it. Unfortunately the intersection on that Venn diagram appears to contain no members, and ultimately I wouldn't wish the experience I've had on anyone else anyway.

All you need to do to force the mod to work in 0.18.0 is change the version in info.json; for the Battery Discharger entity, change the type to "burner-generator" and move the horizontal_animation table into animation; update the path to the uranium ore item's icon.
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Klonan »

Deadlock989 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:32 pm
Less than a fortnight, and already the buzzards are circling the carrion. I wish all this shit-stirring would stay confined to Reddit and Discord where it belongs.

The mod works perfectly well in the stable branch of Factorio. It is, as far as I'm concerned, a finished piece. Given that 0.18.0 appears to be the most pointless update in Factorio's history, it's not exactly onerous to stay on the stable branch for a few weeks longer while you finish your saved games.

For the record: the license is staying exactly as it is, until the mod portal server is turned off. The mod is my work, and it was a lot of work.

I might have handed it over to someone else to look after and maybe adapt further if I could have identified someone who meets all of these criteria: someone who actually bothered to ask; someone with the technical ability and ideally a track record in maintaining half-decent Factorio mods; someone who has the same or similar vision for the mod's balance and mechanics; someone who actually has the time and motivation to do it; someone who isn't going to be a dick about it. Unfortunately the intersection on that Venn diagram appears to contain no members, and ultimately I wouldn't wish the experience I've had on anyone else anyway.

All you need to do to force the mod to work in 0.18.0 is change the version in info.json; for the Battery Discharger entity, change the type to "burner-generator" and move the horizontal_animation table into animation; update the path to the uranium ore item's icon.
I can do it if you want,
I won't have any passion or care for the mod, I won't spend any time feature creeping it or adding more things to it,
Just the necessary fixes if they come up, and keeping it up to date with the latest changes in the base game prototypes etc.

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darkfrei
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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by darkfrei »

Deadlock989 wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:32 pm
I might have handed it over to someone else to look after and maybe adapt further if I could have identified someone who meets all of these criteria:
someone who actually bothered to ask;
someone with the technical ability and ideally a track record in maintaining half-decent Factorio mods;
someone who has the same or similar vision for the mod's balance and mechanics;
someone who actually has the time and motivation to do it;
someone who isn't going to be a dick about it.
I want to ask you about it, but there is no simple way to do it. Personal messages, forum topic and mod discussions are closed.

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Re: IR in 0.18

Post by Jap2.0 »

Well, that was one post that could've been worded much better.

(I should have known to completely stay away from this thread.)
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