mark-for-upgrading when blueprinting over fast-replaceable entities

[Koub]

Allow me to also point to a very similar suggestion (not only focusing on upgrading the fast replaceable entities, but everything that's in the way). I won't merge both because they are still different.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=59554

[Boppiej]

Allow me to also point to a very similar suggestion (not only focusing on upgrading the fast replaceable entities, but everything that's in the way). I won't merge both because they are still different.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=59554

But both of them ideas are usefull to my opinion

[Koub]

Indeed, they try to address very similar issues. I must admit I would choose the more generic one if I had a choice : a way to force build whatever is under a blueprint by deconstructing whatever is underneath OR fast-replacing what can be

[Boppiej]

Indeed, they try to address very similar issues. I must admit I would choose the more generic one if I had a choice : a way to force build whatever is under a blueprint by deconstructing whatever is underneath OR fast-replacing what can be

Agree, or mark for deconstruct or upgrade, i assume?

But for me the first step was the upgrade problem. But why not have both at once

[Koub]

Agree, or mark for deconstruct or upgrade, i assume?

Absolutely : place the ghosts that can be placd as is, fast-replace/upgrade what can be, and finally mark for deconstruction and setup a ghost for the rest.

[Squelch]

My biggest gripe with blueprints/paste is that we can't deconstruct with the pointer while holding the print.

I know this thread is about doing it automatically, but even a manual method to work around having been denied placing a print would be useful.

This is further compounded by how the new nested BPs work, and a previously bot driven deconstruction of defunct base area. It's not uncommon for entities to get left behind because the local roboport is missing, or unpowered. To remove the errant entity, we must dismiss the BP before proceeding. Unless we have placed that rarely used - but important right now - BP on the shortcut bar, dropping it for the manual deconstruction means that we have to drill down through several layers of menu to find it again.

Oh wait! there's another belt hiding under that tree that I missed. Rinse/repeat.

I can fully appreciate why upgrading may be complicated by items or fluids already occupying entities, but I have yet to understand why marking for deconstruction, or manual deconstruction isn't possible while holding a print.

Either an automated "Mark for deconstruction" with the BP (for all entities), or simply allowing us to manually deconstruct while holding a print would be most welcome.

[Boppiej]

I know this thread is about doing it automatically, but even a manual method to work around having been denied placing a print would be useful.

But if the marking for upgrading or destructing works works automaticly (robots), it should also work by hand, then you'll have to replace/destruct the marked items by hand.

Is that what u mean?

[Squelch]

But if the marking for upgrading or destructing works works automaticly (robots), it should also work by hand, then you'll have to replace/destruct the marked items by hand.

Is that what u mean?

Right now, we have no choice but to drop the BP, and then manually deconstruct the entities that block placing the BP. That requires remembering what entities they were, and then having to find the BP again on each attempt. My proposal is to at least allow manual deconstruction while holding the BP as an absolute last resort.

I understand there are complex issues surrounding automated (robots) upgrading while laying a BP due to the possibility of mixed ingredients, and even different recipes in some cases. Should entities also be rotated where they differ too? It sounds like automating it all is complicated, or at least that is the sense I have of the situation. The preferable fall back would be to include mark-for-deconstruction of all entities that conflict with the BP, and then rebuild with the BP entities if fast replace is a can of worms.

[Boppiej]

But if the marking for upgrading or destructing works works automaticly (robots), it should also work by hand, then you'll have to replace/destruct the marked items by hand.

Is that what u mean?

Right now, we have no choice but to drop the BP, and then manually deconstruct the entities that block placing the BP. That requires remembering what entities they were, and then having to find the BP again on each attempt. My proposal is to at least allow manual deconstruction while holding the BP as an absolute last resort.

I understand there are complex issues surrounding automated (robots) upgrading while laying a BP due to the possibility of mixed ingredients, and even different recipes in some cases. Should entities also be rotated where they differ too? It sounds like automating it all is complicated, or at least that is the sense I have of the situation. The preferable fall back would be to include mark-for-deconstruction of all entities that conflict with the BP, and then rebuild with the BP entities if fast replace is a can of worms.

I was hoping this would be added in 1.1, but still hoping

[Skjolbir]

I'm note sure we're understanding each other. What I meant is when I upgrade one entity, I don't always want to upgrade all entities of the same type in all my base. I may want to upgrade just a few entities at strategic locations of my base.

The way I'd do it is have N blueprints, one for every stage of my base, as my research advances, and overwrite the previous version with the new, expecting that all entities of the same type to be "overwritten" if not identical.

same here. Glad im not the first to want this

[Skjolbir]

Agree, or mark for deconstruct or upgrade, i assume?

Absolutely : place the ghosts that can be placd as is, fast-replace/upgrade what can be, and finally mark for deconstruction and setup a ghost for the rest.

The dream

[Soul-Burn]

Agree, or mark for deconstruct or upgrade, i assume?

Absolutely : place the ghosts that can be placd as is, fast-replace/upgrade what can be, and finally mark for deconstruction and setup a ghost for the rest.

Manually shift-placing things allows for fast-replacements, upgrades, undergrounds, rotations, etc.

Even without the automatic deconstruction, it would be great to have a blueprint paste mode that effectively manually shift-places all the entities in the blueprint. The logical order matters, with undergrounds coming first to replace overground belts/pipes.

[nyurik]

I would like to be able to paste a blueprint over existing entities if they can be upgraded or downgraded - i.e. if there is a yellow belt and my blueprint has red - mark it for upgrade. If there is an assembly 3 for something that can be made in assembly 2, it should be marked for downgrade. Is this already possible and/or is there a mod that does that? Searching for "paste upgrade" didn't find anything.

[FuryoftheStars]

While I don’t think you can do this directly with a blueprint, there is the Upgrade planner (whereas blueprints are blue and deconstruction planners are red, upgrade planners are green).

[Tertius]

Yes, the upgrade planner allows this, but it's not possible to make customized or individual upgrades. For example, I designed a mall with 3 or 4 intermediate stages according to the current state of research. Some inserters should be upgraded between the stages, some not. Some belts should be upgraded, but but not all. Some assembling machines should be upgraded, but not all. Some chests should be converted to logistics chests, but not all.

What I would like to see in general is the ability to stamp a blueprint over existing buildings, and whatever was there before should be replaced/upgraded/downgraded to what is in the blueprint, including deconstruction of existing buildings that are not in the blueprint. A big benefit over first deconstructing everything, then build a blueprint on an empty field would be that items in chests can remain in the chests, if the blueprint also contains chests at the place of an existing chest. Or large amounts of belts that don't need to be changed.

Currently, upgrading areas that include storage is somewhat tedious. If I upgrade my mall, I use a custom deconstruction planner that includes everything except chests, then stamp the next version mall blueprint over everything, so stored items don't need to be moved. This approach is tedious if I change the placement of some chests: these need to be deconstructed manually.

[ssilk]

merged with similar topic

I recommend also this link-list
viewtopic.php?p=520461#p520461

Especially
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=59554 (Hotkey to) Replace existing structures with blueprint / Replace with bp / Forced bp placing/deconstruction

[mrvn]

TL;DR

When blueprinting e.g. a red belt over a yellow belt an upgrade ghost should be placed when shift or ctrl is pressed.

What ?

blueprint-upgrade.png (472.5 KiB) Viewed 4075 times

Taking a blueprint on of the right design and placing it over the left one can't place any of the entities because the older versions are in the way. When pressing shift or ctrl this should work like the upgrade planner and mark the entities for an upgrade.

blueprint-upgrade-2.png (120.24 KiB) Viewed 4075 times

Note: This should not just deconstruct any entity that is in the way like it does with trees and rocks. This should only upgrade entities where upgrades are allowed.
Note2: This should work on modules too although I'm not sure if there is a remove-item proxy so it might just be able to insert modules where there aren't any.

Why ?

Upgrading structures when you research new technologies is a powerful way to improve the factory. But doing so with the upgrade planner is tiresome when you don't want to just blanked update whole areas. There often is a balance to the belt speed, inserters and assemblers where different generations of entities remain mixed for best results. Plus the cost of upgrading something that doesn't need to is high.

The blueprint allows up to take a snapshot of a structure and apply it all over the map so we don't have to repeat creating the same structure over and over. This should work for upgrades as well.

[ssilk]

merged with existing topic

Isn’t this a more useful feature when you can also downgrade? And is that not more useful, when you can just replace entities completely, when they are not matching?

Eventually both makes sense, but I point to
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=59554 (Hotkey to) Replace existing structures with blueprint / Replace with bp / Forced bp placing/deconstruction

[robertsonj]

This feature would be great. Upvote from me.

[ickputzdirwech]

[ick] Moved to Implemented in 2.0

viewtopic.php?p=595635#p595635