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Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

https://forums.factorio.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=122884

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Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:23 pm
by TheRailmaker
What did you do?
-Place the blueprint and power it (its 8 simple furnace lines with infinity chests )
-let it run for a while 10 to 30 min
-Check if any of the RED LIGHTS go on.

What happened?
There is spoilage on the OUTPUT belt of the furnaces now

What did you expect to happen instead?
Iron plates should be the only item type on the output belt, since furnaces should burn thier fuel and not give it out

Does it happen always, once, or sometimes?
Blueprint works every time for me.
But it happens in many screnarios. Works best with yumako mash on furnace lines with looped belts.
Most likely, cause they spoil fast. Jelly works aswell.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 6:03 pm
by MechBFP
Anything spoilable can spoil inside of machines before it’s used.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 6:37 pm
by TheRailmaker
MechBFP wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 6:03 pm Anything spoilable can spoil inside of machines before it’s used.
Yes, but the "new spoilage" ends up staying in the FUEL slot and beeing consumed. Test it yourself.


Otherwise builds like this would be stuck every min multiple times and not once every 10 mins.

Also a boiler for example would have the same problem, IF spoiled stuff would not be consumed automatic on its own.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 7:06 pm
by MechBFP
But if the spoilage exceeds the maximum stack size, and no other fuel slots are available to put it in, then I believe it will store the spoilage in a separate slot in the furnace, and that can be removed by inserters.

I haven’t tested it personally yet with furnaces, but every other machine (assemblers, labs, bio chambers, etc) work that way as well.

So my guess is that the spoilage is spilling into that slot.

EDIT: Actually never mind since they only have 1 fuel slot it shouldn’t be possible to reach that max stack size regardless of the fuel used.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:05 pm
by Muche
Using OP's BP I managed to pinpoint the exact moment when it happens.
SpoilageFromFurnaces1-mash.jpg
SpoilageFromFurnaces1-mash.jpg (257.35 KiB) Viewed 222 times
Inserter is trying to refuel the furnace with mash and in exactly 7 ticks the mash in its hand spoils. The furnace has still mash in the fuel slot, so spoilage goes into the trash slot.
SpoilageFromFurnaces2-spoilage.jpg
SpoilageFromFurnaces2-spoilage.jpg (260.48 KiB) Viewed 222 times

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:16 pm
by MechBFP
Muche wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:05 pm Using OP's BP I managed to pinpoint the exact moment when it happens.
SpoilageFromFurnaces1-mash.jpg
Inserter is trying to refuel the furnace with mash and in exactly 7 ticks the mash in its hand spoils. The furnace has still mash in the fuel slot, so spoilage goes into the trash slot.
SpoilageFromFurnaces2-spoilage.jpg
Nice! I was racking my head trying to think how spoilage could get into that trash slot, but that would do it. Not much that can be done about that though, other than filtering the output belt with a splitter set to spoilage at some point.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:31 pm
by Rseding91
MechBFP wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:16 pm
Muche wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:05 pm Using OP's BP I managed to pinpoint the exact moment when it happens.
SpoilageFromFurnaces1-mash.jpg
Inserter is trying to refuel the furnace with mash and in exactly 7 ticks the mash in its hand spoils. The furnace has still mash in the fuel slot, so spoilage goes into the trash slot.
SpoilageFromFurnaces2-spoilage.jpg
Nice! I was racking my head trying to think how spoilage could get into that trash slot, but that would do it. Not much that can be done about that though, other than filtering the output belt with a splitter set to spoilage at some point.
Correct.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2024 1:45 am
by TheRailmaker
Nice! I was racking my head trying to think how spoilage could get into that trash slot, but that would do it. Not much that can be done about that though, other than filtering the output belt with a splitter set to spoilage at some point.
I see 2 options for that :

If wube wants to "fix that" they could:

-Let the inserter wait with spoilage in hand until the fuel slot is free again (which should be fast)
-increase the fuel limit with a second threshold
-let the inserter swing back / try again
-Delete the overflow



If it stays like that, we could blacklist spoilage on every output inserter manual (or filter it later, but thats meh)

However, im sure multiple players will find this type of "bug" soon or later.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2024 2:07 am
by Muche
TheRailmaker wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 1:45 am -Let the inserter wait with spoilage in hand until the fuel slot is free again (which should be fast)
This would result in lower production - in an extreme case the furnace sits idle for almost one hour (ore is supposed to be provided by the inserter stuck with the spoilage) until the current fuel (yumako/jellynut) finishes spoiling, allowing the inserter to drop the spoilage and continue feeding in ore.

Re: Furnaces give out spoilage sometimes which causes stuck belts

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2024 3:31 am
by Loewchen
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