Silver Foam - What am I missing?

pyanodon's mods are here

Moderator: pyanodon

Post Reply
Veez
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:20 pm
Contact:

Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by Veez »

Hello!

First up, thanks for the great Mod-Suite! I'm a bit confused and have a question for other fellow Py-Mod players if they share the same experience or if I'm missing something :).

Background: A friend and me are playing a full-suite PyMod map, we are 120h+ and Post-Circuit 2 on a LTN grid based Map. To prevent us from skipping and rushing certain stuff we put in a 5x tech multiplier, so no shortcuts, we need a stable build for every resource.
At this point I decided to calculate a bit to find out which builds to scale and how big approximately.

I did a calculation for 1 of each science pack per second (with no modules) - for space science I used the quantum computing recipe.
And I stumbled across one subrecipe that was eating 80%-90% of certain resources of the whole base: Silver Foam
Of the highest level stuff, a lot needs a few carbon nanotubes here and there, 2 carbon nanotubes take 5 Biopolymer, with a bit for other recipes 1 space science pack takes 34.8 Biopolymer which in turn takes 24.86 Silver Foam.

Some numbers: To produce this amount of Silver Foam per second:
- 63 Rectisol MK04
- 746 Limestone -> 415 Soil Extractor MK04, that's a nice farm with 17 blue belts of Limestone :shock: .
- Siler-Zinc Alloy: 257 Silver Plate (over 90% of the silver production), 128 Zinc Plates and 2600 RefSyngas :(.
- 5000 Acetylene -> Another 300 MK04 machines calculated from coal as a base (if you do fawogae-based coal it's just 1300 Fawogae farms to supply it :D)
- 5000 Hydrogen Chloride -> This one is cumbersome as Chlorine is only available through Electrolysis (not counting Tholins). With Saline Water from Salt this is another 850 buildings as base game Chemical Plants have no tiers.
And finally probably the most painful:
- 2500 Hydrogen Peroxide (over 75% of the base production):
- 250 Nickel, 200 Chromium, 10k Aromatics and 1k Liquid Nitrogen - all in all another couple of hundred buildings MK04 and I don't even know how to transfer 10k Aromatics per second - with our LTN setup with 1-1 Liquid Trains this is one full train every 2.5 seconds :oops:

I noticed there is no Silver-Zinc Alloy from Molten, but that would only make it a bit better.

So, this shouldn't be a complaint about Py being expensive, because that's no news for us. I rather wanted to check if for Space Science from Quantum Computing half of the base should be build for one sub-product, namely Silver Foam or if I'm missing something? Did anyone every build Space Science from Quantum Computing or is this not feasible? Should you get Space Science the Vanilla way with shooting rockets or will I kill my FPS/Laptop if we aim for Infinite Science?

Once again, thanks for the mods and keep it up, already looking forward to PyAlienLife, have to finish this map quickly to start a new map with it :)!

mxpal
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:53 am
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by mxpal »

because 1 space sci/s is too much..... i built my base for 0.1/s, but there is still so much bugs and improvement to do while the factory is running itself. and for most of the time its the factory that is waiting for me to clear the breakdown instead of me having to wait the factory to churn out sci packs. at worst u can just leave the game to run itself when u are off to do something else. with 5x tech cost i think u should treat it like an idle game, cant expect it to proceed fast

and if u are so determined, then yes u need a ultra huge base for hydrogen chloride and hydrogen peroxide

viewtopic.php?f=219&t=73685
this is my base

Blokus
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 200
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:49 pm
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by Blokus »

As far as I can tell the quantum computer route isn't actually any good, precisely because of issues like this.

That said, your saline should really be sourced from tar quenching, not salt.

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 600
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

1 if you do all science packs recipe via simulation maybe
but for space science roket is the way since it is heavy in Nickel not silver and that is cheeper to get , but on the other hand you need to scale circui1 2 a LOT

NOTE i am nearly done with my 300spm base so i did some serious math before i started

Veez
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by Veez »

Thanks for all your answers! That's a bit sad, that Quantum Computing isn't really viable, was looking forward to doing something different than shooting rockets this game :| . Well that's life I guess.
Blokus wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:49 am
As far as I can tell the quantum computer route isn't actually any good, precisely because of issues like this.

That said, your saline should really be sourced from tar quenching, not salt.
Saline from Tar is definitely smarter, thanks for the tip! We are a bit short on Tar tough, maybe have to switch something else, I'm wondering: Is Aromatics from Creosote from Tar a good way or would you recommend something different?
mxpal wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:12 am
because 1 space sci/s is too much..... i built my base for 0.1/s, but there is still so much bugs and improvement to do while the factory is running itself. and for most of the time its the factory that is waiting for me to clear the breakdown instead of me having to wait the factory to churn out sci packs. at worst u can just leave the game to run itself when u are off to do something else. with 5x tech cost i think u should treat it like an idle game, cant expect it to proceed fast

and if u are so determined, then yes u need a ultra huge base for hydrogen chloride and hydrogen peroxide

viewtopic.php?f=219&t=73685
this is my base
Actually science was never the bottleneck, there is so much stuff to build that even with 5x cost we are researching faster than we are able to use the new researches. So no need to idle.
immortal_sniper1 wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:44 pm
1 if you do all science packs recipe via simulation maybe
That seems super wasteful, as Utility Science isn't even included

mxpal
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:53 am
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by mxpal »

do you use helmod? its a necessity to play py

getting tar from stone and stone from sand extractor is the best way
u can process all the side products into something useful too, and get some iron ore back

Blokus
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 200
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:49 pm
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by Blokus »

Ralesia+fawogae is a cleaner route to aromatics with no real inputs and no byproducts other than oxygen. Desulfurizing that is also a pretty good route to lubricant.

Veez
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Silver Foam - What am I missing?

Post by Veez »

mxpal wrote:
Fri Nov 15, 2019 3:37 am
do you use helmod? its a necessity to play py

getting tar from stone and stone from sand extractor is the best way
u can process all the side products into something useful too, and get some iron ore back
Yes, I do use helmod - that is a nice chain with nice byproducts, but it does it eat some iron plates in the long run. Will play around a bit more with the numbers, thanks!
Blokus wrote:
Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:51 am
Ralesia+fawogae is a cleaner route to aromatics with no real inputs and no byproducts other than oxygen. Desulfurizing that is also a pretty good route to lubricant.
Mh, I turned that down, because that's a lot of Fawogae plantations needed (because there is only MK01 available at the moment) - I think when I calculated it, the footprint was smaller to get Aromatics from Coal-Water-Slurry Fuel if you wash Soil all the way to Pure Sand for Tailings. But this is a lot of buildings as well.

Well I guess I'll combine it - do as many Sand-Extractors as I need Iron Oxide, do as much washing as I need Pure Sand and Benzene and maybe the rest with Ralesia + Fawogae :), if I cancel the Quantum Computing route, that's 10k Aromatics less per second that reliefs the pain a bit :P. Thanks for your help!

Post Reply

Return to “PyMods”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Pridesfall