How to avoid massive coke consumption?

[Dragony]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

[pyanodon]

you cant hide from the massive coke consumption and production. XD

[Dragony]

Why is Coke Processing 1 unusable? You get the recipe for Red Hot Coke, but you can't manufacture it due to the lack of chemical plant, which is gained much later in the tech tree...

[Blokus]

Why is Coke Processing 1 unusable? You get the recipe for Red Hot Coke, but you can't manufacture it due to the lack of chemical plant, which is gained much later in the tech tree...

So presumably what exactly is going on here depends on which pymods you have. In full Py, you make red hot coke in a basic oxygen furnace, unlocked by mining machines 1, and you convert it to coke in a quenching tower, which is unlocked by coal processing 2. This is indeed sp2, so it is a fair bit later into the tech tree. But this is really more of a critique of coal processing 2 being overloaded with stuff, in full Py.

[Dragony]

Hmmm I did not know its unbalanced yet. Maybe I better uninstall it, or just partly?

[Blokus]

Hmmm I did not know its unbalanced yet. Maybe I better uninstall it, or just partly?

In terms of this issue in particular, you really just need to be careful to check what tech unlocks and ingredients are needed to build a building before you try to put a chain into effect.

I ran into this with niobium back before raw ores was a thing. I was trying to make optical fiber and had set up all the ingredients for the niobium plate chain, but then got held back because a building (the ball mill, if I recall correctly) required invar, which I hadn't even researched yet. I could've gotten it, but being held up in that particular way just annoyed me, so I stopped the playthrough there. Coming back now, I just consider caution about buildings to be something that comes with the territory.

[mxpal]

simple....u do realise using coke to produce coal gas is not very efficient? build a larger syngas plant that uses oxygen, then belt the coke out for lead
and do u have access to the high pressure furnace recipe yet?

[immortal_sniper1]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

[immortal_sniper1]

simple....u do realise using coke to produce coal gas is not very efficient? build a larger syngas plant that uses oxygen, then belt the coke out for lead
and do u have access to the high pressure furnace recipe yet?

WAIT people actually use that for coal-gas ??? i see it as just a way to make waste free coalgas from a belt of COAL since the 2 distilations work best is a 1:2 ratio

[Blokus]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

[Blokus]

simple....u do realise using coke to produce coal gas is not very efficient? build a larger syngas plant that uses oxygen, then belt the coke out for lead
and do u have access to the high pressure furnace recipe yet?

I didn't see anyone suggesting that they were using coke -> coal gas (which is indeed basically just a way to get rid of coke you don't want).

[immortal_sniper1]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

[Blokus]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

[immortal_sniper1]

Hi!

I have just started playing the py mods and I wonder if there is a way to avoid the massive coke consumption in the beginning of the game (I have SP1 and a few SP2 researches unlocked).

The problem is that I need an enormous amount of coke for two things:

1. Energy. Instead of using the vanilla steam engines, I am using the combustion turbine. Unfortunately they consume 3 coke for each fuel batch, so its a massive consumer.

2. Lead. Since I need to get lead for ammo, the Acetylene gasifier is running non-stop and the ingredients require very much coke.

What can I do?

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

this is apparently a update failure from 0.17 do thee math again with coke being as 5MJ and see how good turbines are

[Blokus]

1 dude YOU GET MUCH MORE ENERGY FROM THOSE 3 COKE IN THE TURBINE THAN IN THE VANILLA BOILER ,ALSO WHAT OTHER THING DO YOU BURN BASIDES COKE IN THE POWER HOUSE , IF ITS H2 ITS NOT THAT GREAT BETTER USE SYNGAS AND MAKE IT TAR>COALGAS>SYNGAS AND POWER PROBLEMS WILL VANISH !!!

2 YOU CAN HAND CRAFT AMMO FROM STONE AND IRON AND USE THOLENS TO MAKE Acetylene

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

this is apparently a update failure from 0.17 do thee math again with coke being as 5MJ and see how good turbines are

If coke were 5 MJ then indeed the mk1 turbine would be considerably better indeed, but it's not. I'm pretty sure red hot coke would still be better, though, even assuming you're rolling everything you can into fuel (so coal -> coal gas -> syngas and turn the tar into coal gas as well). Though what value should coal dust have? I do think coal dust is somewhat weirdly high.

[Dragony]

Though what value should coal dust have? I do think coal dust is somewhat weirdly high.

Depends on the amount! Factorio is a great master in doing half the business. How much is ONE coal dust? Is it one unit? Then how much kg are it? Or is everything just one kilogram? Can't be, because a train presumebly is not one kilogram of "train", but one piece. Same thing with ore. How much is ONE iron ore?

So it could be that ONE coal dust has a much heigher weight than ONE coke. Inconsistencies suck

[pyanodon]

its actually a blessing...or i and a lot of modders would be buried in technical people trying to make it "realistic" while we dont care much since it´s a game.

[immortal_sniper1]

1. Why are you all caps here?

2. You actually don't get that much more out of the mk1 turbine. 3 coke is 21 MJ; 150 combustion mixture will run the turbine for 2.5s, during which time it's making 14.7 MW, so you get about 37 MJ. About 75% more than putting it in vanilla boilers.

3. The handcraft ammo tip is useful, but OP might not be playing with Py PH and thus might not have access to the tholins recipes.

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

this is apparently a update failure from 0.17 do thee math again with coke being as 5MJ and see how good turbines are

If coke were 5 MJ then indeed the mk1 turbine would be considerably better indeed, but it's not. I'm pretty sure red hot coke would still be better, though, even assuming you're rolling everything you can into fuel (so coal -> coal gas -> syngas and turn the tar into coal gas as well). Though what value should coal dust have? I do think coal dust is somewhat weirdly high.

it is 5MJ now

[Blokus]

you might gen better power with a better secondary input in the power house

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

this is apparently a update failure from 0.17 do thee math again with coke being as 5MJ and see how good turbines are

If coke were 5 MJ then indeed the mk1 turbine would be considerably better indeed, but it's not. I'm pretty sure red hot coke would still be better, though, even assuming you're rolling everything you can into fuel (so coal -> coal gas -> syngas and turn the tar into coal gas as well). Though what value should coal dust have? I do think coal dust is somewhat weirdly high.

it is 5MJ now

So now, 10 coal -> 6 coke + 40 coal gas + 50 tar -> 6 coke + 80 coal gas -> 6 coke + 200 syngas (with oxygen), which is exactly the right ratio to make 300 600C combustion mixture, which will burn in a turbine to supply about 74 MJ. Converting to red hot coke, 6 red hot coke becomes 230 MJ, which costs 24 coal, so scaling back down to 10 coal to match gives about 96 MJ. I've neglected some significant side costs, but still, it appears that even after the update, you are still better off feeding red hot coke into vanilla boilers than you are with mk1 combustion turbines fed with syngas, unless the syngas is undesired (e.g. if you want to burn the coke and syngas and siphon the tar into your chemical complex).

[immortal_sniper1]

Not at that stage; syngas is already 600C, about the only hotter thing that's feasible to reach at that stage is acetylene, which costs too much coke to be viable.

Just in general the mk1 combustion turbine uses coal inefficiently, unless you just want to get some use out of a byproduct (for example, if you want tar, then you might be making more syngas than you need, and thus you might want to throw it into a combustion turbine). Using mk1 combustion turbines in a dedicated power facility is a waste; just use red hot coke quenching to feed vanilla boilers instead.

this is apparently a update failure from 0.17 do thee math again with coke being as 5MJ and see how good turbines are

If coke were 5 MJ then indeed the mk1 turbine would be considerably better indeed, but it's not. I'm pretty sure red hot coke would still be better, though, even assuming you're rolling everything you can into fuel (so coal -> coal gas -> syngas and turn the tar into coal gas as well). Though what value should coal dust have? I do think coal dust is somewhat weirdly high.

it is 5MJ now

So now, 10 coal -> 6 coke + 40 coal gas + 50 tar -> 6 coke + 80 coal gas -> 6 coke + 200 syngas (with oxygen), which is exactly the right ratio to make 300 600C combustion mixture, which will burn in a turbine to supply about 74 MJ. Converting to red hot coke, 6 red hot coke becomes 230 MJ, which costs 24 coal, so scaling back down to 10 coal to match gives about 96 MJ. I've neglected some significant side costs, but still, it appears that even after the update, you are still better off feeding red hot coke into vanilla boilers than you are with mk1 combustion turbines fed with syngas, unless the syngas is undesired (e.g. if you want to burn the coke and syngas and siphon the tar into your chemical complex).

the tar math is bad
when you make syngas you also make TAR
NOTE with 2mk3 productivity modules you can get 1k syngas from 47-50 tar