pY Raw Ores Discussion

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kingarthur
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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by kingarthur »

razahin wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:30 am
kingarthur wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:31 am

no. no thought has been given to improving the distillation recipes as i made it terrible intentionally. its only there because there is like 2 recipes that actually need coal to make science to start unlocking things. its not meant to be good or used passed getting started. burn the raw coal and then unlock raw coal processing to get better coal returns or use fawogae to coal if you think its worth doing.

tldr. i did every thing i could to push you away from raw coal distillation as its a stop gap to fix science issues
Thanks for answering, I'm happy with a "working as intended" response. For my early science coal I just used wood -> coal -> coke since the ratios we're better and I had an abundance of trees. From your answer ("or use fawogae to coal if you think its worth doing") it sounds like there might be a better option I'm missing. I've been operating under the assumption that I have to do coal processing for power until something like Nuclear. I'll have to do some exploring in the tech tree.

Thanks for all your hard work on this mod, I'm really enjoying it.
Its not so much your missing something as it depends on your situation. If you have pypetroleumhanding or pyalienlife effects it. Ore patch size and density. Biters. Simply becuase you want 2. There are a lot of variables that determine that go into it and while some people that play pymods will min max til theyve sucked all the fun out of it you have plenty of ok options.

Usually going with the powerhouse and combustion mixture is a good power source for a while or if you have pypetroleumhanding I've seen people use the oil boiler to make big setups with Natural gas or something as well

error0664
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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by error0664 »

based on side discussion in pyAL thread regarding coke-mk1 processing line of redhot coke, I took a close look in this with a possible solution:

coke-mk01 (red science)
gives coal to coke via HPF and unlocks redhot (but is gated by green science / quenching-tower)
- coke-coal (coal to coke - HPF)

- redhot-coke (coal to redhot-coke + coke-oven-gas)
- quench-redcoke (redhot-coke to coke requires quenching-tower = green science)
- outlet-gas-01 (coke-oven-gas to outlet-gas-01 + sulfur)

coke-mk02 (green science)
gives coke-oven-gas usage and outlet-gas usage

- quench-ovengas (coke-oven-gas to syngas)
3x pyPH recipes all uses coke-oven-gas
- quench-ovengas
- oil-breakdown-2
- tar-breakdown-2

- hot-residual-mixture-to-coke (convert hot-residual-mixture to coke-oven-gas)
- outlet-gas-02 (outlet 1 to outlet 2)

coke-mk03 (chem science)
all outlet 2+ recipes

- scrubber-outletgas2 (outlet 2 to refined syngas)
- scrubber-outletgas4 (outlet 2 to light oil)

- outlet-gas-03 (outlet 2 to outlet 3)
- outlet-gas-04 (outlet 3 to outlet 4)
- outlet-gas-04-breakdown (outlet 4 to flue)


my suggestion is to move 3 redhot-coke recipes from "coke-mk01" to "coke-mk02" (as they are already gated with green science) and only keep coal to coke via HPF in coke-mk01
- outlet-gas-01
- redhot-coke
- quench-redcoke

Code: Select all

  \pyrawores_\prototypes\fluids\outlet-gas-1.lua
	Line 19: }:add_unlock("coke-mk01")
  \pyrawores_\prototypes\recipes\recipes-coke.lua
	Line 17: }:add_unlock("coke-mk01")
	Line 37: }:add_unlock("coke-mk01"):add_ingredient({type = "fluid", name = "pressured-air", amount = 150})

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by Blokus »

That is actually in a github commit from two days ago, just not pushed to the portal.

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by error0664 »

true - nice
including a slight balance on coke production from 40 to 30 when using redhot

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by Emerassi »

Looks like there's an error with a specific file not found in the latest version (pyrawores 2.0.2).

"Failed to load mods: File not found: __pyraworesgraphics__/graphics/icons/coalgas-from-rawcoal.png"

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by kingarthur »

Emerassi wrote:
Sat Mar 14, 2020 2:26 am
Looks like there's an error with a specific file not found in the latest version (pyrawores 2.0.2).

"Failed to load mods: File not found: __pyraworesgraphics__/graphics/icons/coalgas-from-rawcoal.png"
should be fixed now

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by Emerassi »

Thanks for the quick fix. I downloaded the update and it worked fine.

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by toorudez »

When did the recipe chain for Fawogae>Coal change to Fawogae>Raw Coal? I don't see it in any description and it has really affected my base...
Edit: Mostly due to my compact spaghetti. The new chain makes a butt load more coal, so it's all good ;)

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by zx64 »

Is needing two sintered nexelit intended for this molten nexelit recipe?
I ask because it cancels out the 1 reduced to 2 sintered expansion from the sintering step which upsets the usual balance of sintered recipes producing less molten-per-craft in exchange to getting more crafts and thus more molten overall.

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by katalex »

Hello, I find conflict. Installed pyanodons and aai mods only.
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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by Blokus »

katalex wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:43 am
Hello, I find conflict. Installed pyanodons and aai mods only.
Try pycoal touched by an angel. If tbaa doesn't already fix that then they probably just don't care about it.

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by Androix777 »

Recently, I began to deal with titanium recipes that I got with the research "Titanium processing stage 2". There was a new recipe using sand castings. In the process of this production, I get the Titanium pulp stage 3, which can not be used with the researches of logistic science pack. If I don’t use Titanium pulp in any way and get rid of it, then this recipe is even less profitable than the recipe from automation science pack. Then it turns out that this recipe always makes no sense to use on the science pack where it is being studied.
Am I misunderstood something?

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

Androix777 wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 4:50 am
Recently, I began to deal with titanium recipes that I got with the research "Titanium processing stage 2". There was a new recipe using sand castings. In the process of this production, I get the Titanium pulp stage 3, which can not be used with the researches of logistic science pack. If I don’t use Titanium pulp in any way and get rid of it, then this recipe is even less profitable than the recipe from automation science pack. Then it turns out that this recipe always makes no sense to use on the science pack where it is being studied.
Am I misunderstood something?
i will take a look tho i am 95% sure higher tier recipes are better

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

yes it is a small problem will fix

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by razahin »

With all the processes that PyRO added I noticed that Niobium wasn't expanded upon, and that there is only a single line for it. Are there any plans to expand it with multiple stages like the other materials?

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

razahin wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 9:00 pm
With all the processes that PyRO added I noticed that Niobium wasn't expanded upon, and that there is only a single line for it. Are there any plans to expand it with multiple stages like the other materials?
it already has a dedicated chain and unlike other ores you can use productivity in this case as a means to increase the plates from ore made

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by ukezi »

I will make a bit of a review I'm playing with the set besides hightech eand alien as hightech's basic circuits was too big a chore.

The 15:120 ratio in iron and copper at the start is brutal. Especially with the 1:10 for for steel and the amount you need for the basic machines.

Then however then there is a split.
Iron
  1. basic 15:120
  2. hot air 15:80
  3. In Iron you get the ore->processed iron->hot air with 15:25. That is a giant step, a too big step in my mind. You also get 5 stone.
  4. After that is the first molten iron stage with 15:20.9 ore->processed+borax->molten+borax->plate, were you need lots of new machines and borax and sand castings. But way way less electrical power also very low reuse of machines. Also the ratio crusher:Basic Oxi furnace is not straight, 8.34:20. The direct casting of small parts and so on is quite strong, you get about double the result per input. Getting all that product out of the machines is quite difficult however, even with how big they are.
copper
has a different chain
  1. basic 15:120
  2. hot air 15:80
  3. ore->grade1+grade2->(grade1->grade2+stone)->copper plate with 15:75. You get also 15 stone you have to get rid off and lots and lots of big expensive machines
  4. molten stage: ore->grade1+grade2->(grade1->grade2+stone) ->grade3+(rejects->grade3+gravel)->(grade4+(low-grade rejects->(long chain for the last bit of yield)-> +borax->molten->+borax+casting->copper and all that for 15:16.6 Now that is a lot of chain at once but the reward is also huge and a bit big of a step in my opinion.
Glass
you need quite a lot of it for science
  1. basic 15:90 sounds not bad but the miners are huge 9x9 and not that fast only 1/s.
  2. hot air 15:60 nice upgrade
  3. crushed->glas works 15:50 not a great upgrade, fueling the 20 glassworks is nearly impossible, each of them needs 27MW of fuel. If I were to fuel that with tar that would require 270 stone.
  4. crushed+ pure sand 15:37.5 and lots and lots of pure sand, where you need a lot of Gravel from stone(83.4) for instance or soil(140.7) for.
Tin
  1. baisc 15:120
  2. hot air 15:100
  3. ore->grade1+(grade2->grade1+stone)->plate 15:75
  4. molten chain alnalog to copper 15:42
Alu
follows the simple chain from iron quite close but the machine ratios aren't nice
  1. basic 15:150
  2. hot air 15:50
  3. molten 15:30
    You don't really need that much of it in the early stages
Borax is 1:1
So what would I change?
  1. Steel: Instead of just throwing lots of iron at it do something interesting with stuff from coal processing, maybe some coal gas or something.
  2. Glas: Faster miners, they are 9x as big as basic ones, they should be 9x as fast, so 4.5/s. At 1/s you need 26.67 of the giants for the hot air chain to support 1 red science/s. Also lower the fuel consumption of glasworks to 1/10 to 1/20 at least. Also change the molten recipe to something more reasonable
  3. Why do some materials have simple improved chains while others do not? Why are the yields so different? Why do some chains have all that grade 1-4 stuff and some not? Is that still WIP?
  4. I would streamline a bit. All basic is 15:120, hot air is 15:100, first stage processing+furnace is 15:80( maybe drop this recipe and have the yield of the next stages lower), with hot air 15:60. The first stage molten gets you 15:40. Stage 2 molten would do 15:20 and later stages better then 1:1. I would change batch sizes and recipe time for nice even machine ratios. Or do an other function that is such that the stages are relative evenly better to each other, with my proposal the later stages get exponential better.

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

2 yes those mines are very slow
3 not sure py made the chain i only balanced it ask him
4 hot air is from pyPH not pyRO so not all have it
some metals were supposed to be more expensive/harder to get then others and that is reflected in mining cost and processing chain
yes i would like to make machines rations to me 1:1 or 1:2 for direct insertion but there are a few problems there :
  • atm i was working on pyAL stuff so i was sorta busy , and doing such balance would more or less mean i have to adjust nearly all recipes time and maybe the amoount made from all intermediaries [and that will break peoples bases]
  • some buildings have uneven speed progressions , not the standard 1 2 3 4
  • even if the upper ones are gone i cant update stuff on my own py and king are the ones that make the git commits
1 not sure ask py

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by kots01 »

Hi guys! Do you have plans to add casting recipes for solder or small parts-02-03?

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Re: pY Raw Ores Discussion

Post by kingarthur »

kots01 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 4:15 pm
Hi guys! Do you have plans to add casting recipes for solder or small parts-02-03?
could look at adding solder as a casting recipe. i dont feel small parts 2 and 3 really fit being casted as they have a lot of none metal ingredients

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