pY Coal Processing - Discussion

pyanodon's mods are here

Moderator: pyanodon

Post Reply
immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

warning for all:

When it comes to the new glass works buildings in come cases (mk2-4 and modules) the power usage can increase enough enough that not all fluids can fully satisfy the power of the building (since it can only burn 600/s) so H2 is not enough as fuel from a point on
NOTE a MK4 with full speed mk3 (max power usage) can operate with syngas
so in most cases there will not be problems but i advise you check the power usage (tho in most cases this will not be a problem )

DreadIron
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 5:12 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by DreadIron »

Isn't it a typo that glassworks now have 27MW consumption? That is major bottleneck early on. Like all syngas sinks to that and there is no left for turbines. I would say 6MW would be better. What do you think?

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

DreadIron wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:18 pm
Isn't it a typo that glassworks now have 27MW consumption? That is major bottleneck early on. Like all syngas sinks to that and there is no left for turbines. I would say 6MW would be better. What do you think?
6MW is 4/s natural gas atm so it is like nothing

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

also atm you can automize CO2 wood at red science , if i remember well , so you can make it from just power and water and yes it is a positive power loop too

for mk1 it is 27MJ syngas was 400kj/unit , i think, so 67-68/s not much also if you use O2 in syngas you also get bonus H2 as fuel

User avatar
esso23
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:59 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by esso23 »

immortal_sniper1 wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:21 pm
DreadIron wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:18 pm
Isn't it a typo that glassworks now have 27MW consumption? That is major bottleneck early on. Like all syngas sinks to that and there is no left for turbines. I would say 6MW would be better. What do you think?
6MW is 4/s natural gas atm so it is like nothing
Not sure how you got to that number. I just tried it and it consumes 67 syngas per SECOND at 27MW consumption, which means it would consume ~15syngas/s at 6MW which is still like insanely high (i mean pY mods are insane, but this is just stupid). 27MW is obviously either a typo or just bad design.

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

esso23 wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:53 pm
immortal_sniper1 wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:21 pm
DreadIron wrote: ↑
Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:18 pm
Isn't it a typo that glassworks now have 27MW consumption? That is major bottleneck early on. Like all syngas sinks to that and there is no left for turbines. I would say 6MW would be better. What do you think?
6MW is 4/s natural gas atm so it is like nothing
Not sure how you got to that number. I just tried it and it consumes 67 syngas per SECOND at 27MW consumption, which means it would consume ~15syngas/s at 6MW which is still like insanely high (i mean pY mods are insane, but this is just stupid). 27MW is obviously either a typo or just bad design.
i used the numbers from my memory so yes it appears i was wrong

DreadIron
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 5:12 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by DreadIron »

The thing is like all buildings consume cca 1MW of power and glassworks 27MW. That is 1 order of magnitude more. How do you balance recipes when there is so much power difference? E.g. glass 1 making(Quartz making stage 1): I would rather make it with hot air than in glassworks. Sure you get more glass 40% rather then 25%. But at what cost? With hot air it is 1,4MJ per 1 glass. In glassworks, you need 27MJ of energy(4s at 27MW = 4glass). It's clearly not balanced.

mrbaggins
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 90
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:08 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by mrbaggins »

immortal_sniper1 wrote: ↑
Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:14 am
mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:19 am
Glassworks fuel?

Edit: It appears fuel liquids in PIPES show the value, but not in recipes/FNEI/Research screen.
the building itself can also display the value
Mine doesn't? It will if I have fuel in it, but that's beside the point. I want to find out what the fuels are worth so I can make decisions.
(You can see the fuel values inside FNEI if you enable the debug option show-debug-info-in-tooltips.)
That helps, but now my tooltips are huge. I'll keep it on until an update hits.

Also agree. It consumes a TONNE of power.
Last edited by mrbaggins on Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

DreadIron
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 5:12 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by DreadIron »

mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:25 am
immortal_sniper1 wrote: ↑
Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:14 am
mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:19 am
Glassworks fuel?

Edit: It appears fuel liquids in PIPES show the value, but not in recipes/FNEI/Research screen.
the building itself can also display the value
Mine doesn't? It will if I have fuel in it, but that's beside the point. I want to find out what the fuels are worth so I can make decisions.
(You can see the fuel values inside FNEI if you enable the debug option show-debug-info-in-tooltips.)
That helps, but now my tooltips are huge. I'll keep it on until an update hits.
You can lookup values at github. Note: this is not complete list but you can search for more https://github.com/pyanodon/pycoalproce ... a.lua#L232

User avatar
zx64
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2016 3:57 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by zx64 »

PH values: https://github.com/pyanodon/pypetroleum ... a.lua#L146 (haven't checked if the commented out values for the other mods have diverged).
RO values: https://github.com/pyanodon/pyrawores/b ... a.lua#L292

If you're looking for maxing energy density, then consider fuel oil, diesel or kerosene - each are 1.5MJ and PH adds a lot of options for producing those.

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

in the case of fuel oil it will not stay like that for long

Eloth
Burner Inserter
Burner Inserter
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:46 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by Eloth »

Getting this error when loading game

The mod Pyanodons Coal Processing (1.7.4) caused a non-recoverable error.
Please report this error to the mod author.

Error while running event pycoalprocessing::on_nth_tick(1)
Gui element with name pywiki_frame already present in the parent element.
stack traceback:
__pycoalprocessing__/scripts/wiki.lua:42: in function 'handler'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:334: in function 'pcall'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:354: in function 'dispatch_event'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:437: in function <__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:388>
stack traceback:
[C]: in function 'add'
__pycoalprocessing__/scripts/wiki.lua:42: in function 'handler'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:334: in function 'pcall'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:354: in function 'dispatch_event'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:437: in function <__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:388>

aklesey1
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1846
Joined: Sun May 18, 2014 3:45 pm
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by aklesey1 »

Last update of PY Petroleum Handling removed vanilla Oil Refinery
Another update of PY Coal processing added GlassWorks building with 4 tiers

I have issue - may of py recipes are making in vanila chemical plant and chemical plant have only 1 tier! So i can accelerate it only with modules - in 0.17 i could use bob's assembly machines mod but its not working with suite
My suggestion to pyanodon and his tier - pls make 3 additional tiers for chemical plant specially for py mods - as example Angel's Petrochem containes advanced chemical plant with 3 inputs and 3 outputs specially for Angel's mods
Or pls make some analog of vanilla chemical plant with 4 tiers, i'm asking bcuz u decided to add GlassWorks building specially for PY mods
Last edited by aklesey1 on Wed Apr 15, 2020 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Nickname on ModPortal - Naron79

kingarthur
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1428
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:39 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by kingarthur »

Eloth wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:45 pm
Getting this error when loading game

The mod Pyanodons Coal Processing (1.7.4) caused a non-recoverable error.
Please report this error to the mod author.

Error while running event pycoalprocessing::on_nth_tick(1)
Gui element with name pywiki_frame already present in the parent element.
stack traceback:
__pycoalprocessing__/scripts/wiki.lua:42: in function 'handler'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:334: in function 'pcall'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:354: in function 'dispatch_event'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:437: in function <__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:388>
stack traceback:
[C]: in function 'add'
__pycoalprocessing__/scripts/wiki.lua:42: in function 'handler'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:334: in function 'pcall'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:354: in function 'dispatch_event'
__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:437: in function <__stdlib__/stdlib/event/event.lua:388>
should be fixed with 1.7.5

mrbaggins
Long Handed Inserter
Long Handed Inserter
Posts: 90
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:08 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by mrbaggins »

Anyone got more info on what glassworks fuel they're using?

I think I'm going to fall back to methane. Highish value, cheap to make (but big).

For the mod authors: Suggestion: I'd like to see a "liquid fuel" needed for glassworks that can come from a variety of sources, much like combustion mixture. This way I can send left over gases / liquids to a reprocessing plant to be turned into liquid fuel.

Then hydrogen can make 20 units of it, methane can make 800 units of it etc at the same levels (or whatever levels as now) but people only need to supply one fuel to glassworks.

Even without this, realistically I'm just going to stack into one fuel type (methane probably) for the forseeable future. Acetylene is another possible one once I upgrade my coke production to Navens.

kingarthur
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 1428
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:39 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by kingarthur »

mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:51 am

For the mod authors: Suggestion: I'd like to see a "liquid fuel" needed for glassworks that can come from a variety of sources, much like combustion mixture. This way I can send left over gases / liquids to a reprocessing plant to be turned into liquid fuel.
So why not just use combustion mixture?

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

kingarthur wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:55 am
mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:51 am

For the mod authors: Suggestion: I'd like to see a "liquid fuel" needed for glassworks that can come from a variety of sources, much like combustion mixture. This way I can send left over gases / liquids to a reprocessing plant to be turned into liquid fuel.
So why not just use combustion mixture?
because combustion mix in glass works is 0.1MJ and glass works dont care about its temperature , so it is slightly better then natural gas

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

mrbaggins wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:51 am
Anyone got more info on what glassworks fuel they're using?

I think I'm going to fall back to methane. Highish value, cheap to make (but big).

For the mod authors: Suggestion: I'd like to see a "liquid fuel" needed for glassworks that can come from a variety of sources, much like combustion mixture. This way I can send left over gases / liquids to a reprocessing plant to be turned into liquid fuel.

Then hydrogen can make 20 units of it, methane can make 800 units of it etc at the same levels (or whatever levels as now) but people only need to supply one fuel to glassworks.

Even without this, realistically I'm just going to stack into one fuel type (methane probably) for the forseeable future. Acetylene is another possible one once I upgrade my coke production to Navens.
naturam gas will not work for very long sine you need tons of it and if you plan to upgarde to mk2 not sure if natural gas will be enough
since you have a 600/s fuel max cap and with natural gas you have 600*90=54MW , yes it will feed them at max power but then the pipe logistics become hard

regarding the fuel idea you proposed :
those are a lot of recipes that are converting liquids into 1 liquid at a ratio we have atm , also with the way you did think it , with fix liquid input and a variable output you will end up with huge flow amounts needed later on

anyway why not use syngas ?
there is a liquid fuel value wiki in game now too

mathiaszealot
Inserter
Inserter
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2019 9:20 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by mathiaszealot »

If you're nearly up to Navens, why not feed in Fuel Oil? It's a simple conversion from Oil in a DDC with decent MJ value (0.8MJ). It's lossy relative to full oil processing, but it's simple to process and source; all you need is a few DDCs and a small oil field or some drilling fluid.

immortal_sniper1
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 771
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:54 am
Contact:

Re: pY Coal Processing - Discussion

Post by immortal_sniper1 »

mathiaszealot wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:03 pm
If you're nearly up to Navens, why not feed in Fuel Oil? It's a simple conversion from Oil in a DDC with decent MJ value (0.8MJ). It's lossy relative to full oil processing, but it's simple to process and source; all you need is a few DDCs and a small oil field or some drilling fluid.
that is a valid chaince , simple and like a X10 more dense then crude

Post Reply

Return to β€œPyMods”