[1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Topics and discussion about specific mods
mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Something like 220° or 230°.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

With Electrolysis 3 comes the recipe for Hydrogen Chloride -> Hydrogen + Chlorine. Is there any good reason not to use this for the plastic factory so it recycles all it's Hydrogen Chloride right on the spot? Seems to make things much simpler for a train base. Seems better than using Hydrochloric neutralization unless I'm overlooking something.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

That would be a good use for that recipe, yes.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Would it be possible to make a battery equipment that doesn't need experimental chemistry? Maybe just a lower density version based on the capacitor. I find myself with some free space in the Chasis 2.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

The capacitor is equippable. As are all the solar panel 1s you started with. A lot of the equipment in Nullius is multi-purpose, so stuff in your armor can be taken out and placed independently as structures, and vice versa.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Oh great. I noticed that I could place the equiped starting stuff but I didn't even try equipping capacitors. Sorry for the noise.

Now I wonder if I should replace my charging pad with a second solar cell. 10MJ battery power with 2 roboports and one charger as equipment doesn't last long. The charger adds 4MJ energy storage while a second solar cell would double the power. Decisions, decisions. Maybe I should just place zone expanders and charging pads everywhere and build a massive construction grid now. I'm about at the point where I could do that.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Steam temp and turbines

Post by mrvn »

When I look at the steam recipes it says min temp. 165°C and max temp. 200°C. But when I look at the backup turbine it says max temp. 1600°C. Is that correct or is another mod breaking things?

With my steam only having 165°C I only get 130kW out of a backup turbine 1, far from the 1MW max power. That kind of sucks.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

The temperature has nothing to do with anything. It's cosmetic. The game requires that fluids have a temperature, but Nullius turbines don't care about that. Nullius steam tells you exactly how much energy it has in it right in the tooltip. 8kJ per unit of steam, exactly. If you're only getting 130kW, that's something else, unrelated to temperature. One possible explanation is that you don't need more than 130kW at the moment. The way that Factorio reports power usage, it only gets reported as being generated if it's actually consumed by something. Another possible explanation is that it's not full of steam. Keep in mind that by design, backup turbines don't power surge equipment, so if your surge equipment isn't running on backup power, that's intended. Surge equipment uses only surplus power, and wouldn't function properly for its intended role otherwise.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

It is another mod messing with the fluids. All the fluids are compressed by a factor of 10 so the amounts of fluids and items match more closely and I don't have stations needing 10 fluid trains for every item train to work. But then the steam must have 80kJ energy instead of 8kJ to restore the turbine. Thanks, missed the energy density.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

The Nullius 1.2.0 major release is now available, including a new feature to build extra android bodies and switch control between them at will.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Somehow my shopping mall is a total chaos. Everything needs different things and there are some loops you have to break because you can't fit assemblers close enough to make direct assembler - assembler insertion. Am I the only one having problems making a tidy shopping mall? I gave up and went with logistic bots for everything that I couldn't connect directly, no belts for basic items as there are too many.
shopping.png
shopping.png (4.33 MiB) Viewed 4812 times


Note: Playing Angles&Bobs there as a real pattern to the belts and inserters and (deadlock) loaders with all of them needing the same things. So you can lay them out in a grid with belts and inserters on one axis and black, yellow, red, blue, green, purple on the other axis and then have belts down or across with just one or two exceptions. I miss that.

User avatar
disentius
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 694
Joined: Fri May 12, 2017 3:17 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by disentius »

Yep. the belt fed one was a glorious spagetthy mess. Just spend to many hours to convert all to a bot mall... happyhappyjoyjoy!

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

disentius wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:46 am
Yep. the belt fed one was a glorious spagetthy mess. Just spend to many hours to convert all to a bot mall... happyhappyjoyjoy!
Me too. The time between needing a mall and having requester chests was a pain.

User avatar
disentius
Filter Inserter
Filter Inserter
Posts: 694
Joined: Fri May 12, 2017 3:17 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by disentius »

not perfect, but better:
Attachments
2021-09-20 20_11_19-Window.png
2021-09-20 20_11_19-Window.png (1.8 MiB) Viewed 4752 times

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Yeah, that's the really lazy method, do everything by bot. I tried to tie things together into chains where the output of one assembler is the input for the next. Try to reduce the amount of bot traffic a bit because Logistic bots version 1 with not capacity or speed bonus are snails and I have too few of them on top.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Charging pads steal power from zone expanders

Post by mrvn »

It's probably not something you did but in the debug info every item shows up as modified by nullius, so you get first blame. :)

When you have a low power situation with equal numbers of charging pads and zone expanders then charging pad get a much higher percentage of power than zone expanders. In my case the charging pads hover close to 100% with barely a dip in the provided energy while the zone expanders hover around 0.

And when a zone expanders hits 0 energy left it drops out of the logistic zone. Potentially the logistic zone splits and that causes all bots to retask. This gives a massive CPU spike and any bot with a goal on the other side of the split returns their items of picks a new job. And with the wind turbines going up and down this currently happens frequently. My game drops from 60 FPS/UPS to 3 FPS/UPS for minutes at a time till there is more wind again. (I'm currently having a wind crisis it seems. 300+ turbines make 0-50 MW)

It would really help if zone expanders (and roboports) would get a higher power priority than charging pads.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

OK, that seems reasonable to make them higher priority. And in the case of zone expanders I can give them longer storage, since they don't use a ton of power. For roboports giving them decent storage is harder since they're also chargers which can consume a lot quickly. Maybe that's what the recharge minimum field does? I'll look into it.

Wind Turbines are cheap and effective, but they need to be supplemented with energy storage. Surge electrolyzer -> hydrogen + oxygen -> combustion chamber -> backup turbine is the lowest tech battery option, available around the same time as wind turbines. In electrical engineering you can use all that surplus nitrogen as an energy storage medium using the surge compressor. Compressed nitrogen has very high energy density and the nitrogen is basically free.

mrvn
Smart Inserter
Smart Inserter
Posts: 5686
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:10 am
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by mrvn »

Anachrony wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:31 am
OK, that seems reasonable to make them higher priority. And in the case of zone expanders I can give them longer storage, since they don't use a ton of power. For roboports giving them decent storage is harder since they're also chargers which can consume a lot quickly. Maybe that's what the recharge minimum field does? I'll look into it.

Wind Turbines are cheap and effective, but they need to be supplemented with energy storage. Surge electrolyzer -> hydrogen + oxygen -> combustion chamber -> backup turbine is the lowest tech battery option, available around the same time as wind turbines. In electrical engineering you can use all that surplus nitrogen as an energy storage medium using the surge compressor. Compressed nitrogen has very high energy density and the nitrogen is basically free.
Sure. I did build some but with the long time without wind I've run out of steam. I have to extend the storage and also double the whole thing so it can last a few (factorio) days.

I have compressed nitrogen researched. But how do I use that? Just compress it and pump it into a turbine instead of steam?

Seems logical now that I write it. What makes steam work isn't the heat but the pressure caused by the heat. So any compressed gas will do. Currently I'm venting basically all my nitrogen so yeah: free.

I guess building a 1M compressed nitrogen storage facility is on tomorrows agenda then. Assuming wind picks up soon and gets me out of those 3FPS/UPS. The game is unplayable. I'm crafting 20 sterling engines now and have solar collectors already. I hope that gets me out of the unplayable zone or maybe a fixed zone expander is out when I play next...

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

Nullius is the community map for October and November:
https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... mber_2021/

mrvn wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:22 am
I hope that gets me out of the unplayable zone or maybe a fixed zone expander is out when I play next...
I opted not to change the power priority on zone expander, since the consumption is not trivial and it could cause issues, and the hangar which people also use for its logistic zone, is even less trivial. However, what I did instead is to increase its buffer, increase its maximum charge rate by a lot, and reduce its power consumption. What I hope that increasing the charge rate does is to give it a higher proportion of the available electricity in a low power situation, while the low consumption hopefully means it can stay operational. Plus it can save up several minutes of operation while power generation is stronger.

Anachrony
Fast Inserter
Fast Inserter
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:55 pm
Contact:

Re: [1.1] Nullius: A Factorio prequel

Post by Anachrony »

The latest update introduces a new, very non-vanilla type of beacon. Existing beacons are now called "small beacons", and behave the same, unless you combine them with the new type. Those beacons are similar to vanilla, just with variations in power usage and effectiveness. The new beacons, "large" beacons, are size 4x4, with an effect radius of 12 tiles (so it spans a total area of 28x28). Tier 1, available with the same tech as small beacon 2, supports 1 module at 100% effectiveness, for 1MW, while Tier 2 supports 2 modules for 2.5MW.

There are 2 major limitations: 1) a large beacon may not fall within the area of effect of another large beacon. That's not to say that their effects can't intersect with one another, but the beacon structure itself has to be outside of that area of effect. So you can tile large beacons in grids spaced 16 tiles apart, with overlapping regions of 4 large beacon effects in 12x12 squares between them. There are other patterns that make sense, but this is the densest and a natural way to space them.

2) Any small beacons falling within the area of effect of a large beacon will have its effects diminished. This scales based on how many large beacon effects it's affected by. Once again, this only applies to the beacon itself and not its area of effect, so you can arrange them in patterns where the small beacons have less interference, but the machines nearby have many effects stacked. Currently 1 large beacon only suppresses it by 10%, and 2 by 20%, but 3 drops to 50%, and 4 80%. Though I'm thinking of making those last 2 slightly less punitive, like 40% and 70%. Slotting small beacons in zones where only 2 large beacons overlap is clearly the sweet spot and you get diminishing returns putting small beacons in areas with heavy large beacon coverage.

I think this allows for some interesting and diverse new options for beaconed builds. I've already seen more viable configurations with it after a few days of playing around with it than I've ever seen with just vanilla style beacons.

Post Reply

Return to “Mods”