[MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

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ownlyme
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by ownlyme » Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:18 pm

Lol, sounds like you're making a real science out of it ;)
Indeed, a stopped reactor cools down 0.5° per second, but it's usually still connected to the heat pipes so the heat gets constantly lost.
So it's a good practice to not place much more reactors than you'd need in the worst case.
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by Sorda » Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:29 pm

We could wait even more though, to get even more power and efficiency!
At 945 to 950C the reactor outputs exactly 80MW at 149% efficiency. Try calculating the fuel cell value and how long it will last yourself, to see if you have grasped how it works by now. Running precisely 8 heat exchangers would allow us to consume all the heat generated and keep the reactor stable.
Sounds pretty good, right? Start the reactor, disable heat exchangers, let it heat to 945, enable heat exchangers, boom, you got yourself a stable 80MW single reactor.
This is all good only on paper. According to all that you wrote, it turns out that you need to play a skipping rope with a reactor, where it will give out power for some time, and for some time not to give it out at all in order to warm up again.
Since the energy stored in the tubes, especially with regard to heat exchangers that are further from the reactor, is not consumed more slowly than the reactor heats up, there will be power drawdowns in the network anyway, isn’t that so?

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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by aka13 » Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:16 pm

Sorda wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:29 pm
We could wait even more though, to get even more power and efficiency!
At 945 to 950C the reactor outputs exactly 80MW at 149% efficiency. Try calculating the fuel cell value and how long it will last yourself, to see if you have grasped how it works by now. Running precisely 8 heat exchangers would allow us to consume all the heat generated and keep the reactor stable.
Sounds pretty good, right? Start the reactor, disable heat exchangers, let it heat to 945, enable heat exchangers, boom, you got yourself a stable 80MW single reactor.
This is all good only on paper. According to all that you wrote, it turns out that you need to play a skipping rope with a reactor, where it will give out power for some time, and for some time not to give it out at all in order to warm up again.
Since the energy stored in the tubes, especially with regard to heat exchangers that are further from the reactor, is not consumed more slowly than the reactor heats up, there will be power drawdowns in the network anyway, isn’t that so?
Boy are you toxic. It's not on paper, it's based on a setup I am running. Try rereading what I wrote and all your questions are gonna answer themselves.

Image

You need to look at the temperature delta, postive or negative, why would you want to turn off the heat exchangers all at the same time? You simply need a balancing system.

Second think I think you try to describe the "inertia" I spoke of. It's simply one additional factor to consider.
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by ownlyme » Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:25 pm

Is there anything i could do to deescalate this thread?
Maybe reduce environmental cooling when a reactor is turned off? (its currently a fixed amount (0.5°/s), which is not optimal anyway...)
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by aka13 » Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:46 pm

ownlyme wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:25 pm
Is there anything i could do to deescalate this thread?
Maybe reduce environmental cooling when a reactor is turned off? (its currently a fixed amount (0.5°/s), which is not optimal anyway...)
I am sorry if you perceive this as an eskalation. Was not meant to be one. I am actually very satisfied with the mechanics as they are right now. On top of my head there is no real improvement I would suggest. I always thought int would be fun to see mechanics akin to ic2 with the reactor inventory minigame, but your vision went well beyond that.

Perhaps a power generator with similar mechanics, but for burning normal fuel? Since the steam engines produce so little, you are more or less bound to ditch classical coal/solid fuel burning completely.
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by Sorda » Sat Aug 10, 2019 12:27 am

~~Snip snip, the feeling doctor has come and snipped out something interesting~~

Can you give a blueprint and a screenshot where you can examine your reactor design in more detail?

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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by ownlyme » Sat Aug 10, 2019 12:40 am

I think normal burner turbines are still kinda viable as night-supply, emergency power and outpost-power.
Also i don't really have an idea for something more complex that makes sense.
There's still the diesel generator from https://mods.factorio.com/mod/KS_Power if you're into that sort of thing (i personally changed a few parameters of it for my game, but otherwise its pretty cool)
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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by RocketManChronicles » Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:12 pm

@OwnlyMe
I get the premise of how the heat pipe switch is supposed to work, but maybe I need a small clarification. It obviously is a remodel of the power switch, and operates the same way, I get that. But I noticed it does not "graphically connect" heat pipes to it. So, my assumption is it does connect to any heat pipe adjacent to it (N, S, E, W) and does not transfer the heat to another connected to it (N, S, E, W) while it is open. Am I correct on this? Otherwise, I can see this as an extremely useful object to control the heat transfer to the heat exchangers via the circuit network.

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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by Musil » Sun Nov 17, 2019 3:13 pm

This is a great mod.
One of the best. Really deserves to be in vanilla.

Only shame is we don't have one which would use the game's temperature of fluid property and eliminate the heat pipes. I mean, heat exchangers that would use hot water from the reactor passing through them. Doesn't seem too complicated to write, but maybe there's some sort of snag there.

Well, got confused for five minutes because I confused 'starting' icon with the icon for the 'start reactor' signal, and was wondering why it wasn't starting up.

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Re: [MOD 0.16] Realistic Reactors

Post by Musil » Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:36 pm

IngoKnieto wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 pm
...
There's a small issue with the mod; if you use it together with mods that add items that use the basemod nuclear reactor as ingredient, and have the vanilla reactor disabled so it's easy power generation won't tempt you, the recipes don't work.

To a dip a toe into lua, I wrote a small fix for Rampant Arsenal data-updates to fix this for my use.

Code: Select all

 function searchAndFixRecipe(attribute, toReplace, replaceWith,recipeType)
    local recipe = attribute
    recipeType = recipeType or " "
    local recipe_name = recipe.name or recipeType
    
    for _, root in pairs{recipe, recipe.normal, recipe.expensive} do
      if type(root) == "table" and root.ingredients then
            local ingredients = root.ingredients
            for _, ingredient in pairs(ingredients) do
                if ingredient.name == toReplace then 
                        ingredient.name = replaceWith
                        log(serpent.block("Fixed ingredient " .. toReplace .. " in " ..  recipe_name .. " recipe type " .. recipeType))
                end    
            end
      end
    end
end

if mods["RealisticReactors"] then
    log(serpent.block("Starting to check for default reactor item  in ingredients to replace it with realistic-reactor for compatibility with RealisticReactors"))
    for index, recipe in pairs(data.raw.recipe) do
        --log(serpent.block("ingredient " .. index))
        searchAndFixRecipe(recipe, "nuclear-reactor", "realistic-reactor")
    end
end
^^
but I guess it could just run with realistic reactors if the vanilla one is disabled.

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