Factorio Forums

Finndibaenn wrote:

jonhwoods wrote:[*] Is it possible to use a tool like [https://bitbucket.org/Nicksaurus/forem ... 's Foreman to plan ratios and production lines? I could not manage to make that tool work, and resorted on extensive time consuming Excel sheets instead.[/*]

I'm using Helmod plugin for this

knightofrust wrote:How do you get hydrogen sulfide gas from washing mud water? Is that an addition of sea block? Because in the base game (0.16) + angel's this same recipe gives only mud + heavy mud water.

This change (since seablock 0.16) allows you to get sulfur, because you cannot get coal anymore. Smelting wood bricks gives charcoal as substitute for coke/coal. But theres no way to get sulfur from it.
You can check this thread from about page 9 for posts of Trainwreck, what else changed.

Finndibaenn wrote: I'm using Helmod plugin for this

Me too, its not always possible to get a full overview, because of those loopy recipes

Finndibaenn wrote:Here is what I came up with, based on the above screen shot.

I had some throughput issues with belts so washing plants deposit directly into chests.
as 1 chest can not be in range of all crushers, 2 filter inserters move the appropriate geodes between the 2 above chests.

the crushed geodes are deposited directly into the liquifiers (I found I needed 2 MK3 but that may be because the washing plants ran for a while while the liquifiers were stopped).

I also found crushed stone production from geodes (even adding the output from ore production) was not enough to produce the mineralized waster, so I have 2 spare elecrolyzers to produce slag (belt turns of when mineralized water > 50% which is why the belt is backed up)

Strange, I found that I had excess mineralized water just from the geode crushing. Add to that mineralized water from sulfuric waste water treatment and I could run green algae farm full time and a second part time to produce charcoal (eventually). Charcoal is then used for the charcoal filters and to run one boiler and steam engine for some extra power. Also I kept the washing machines output onto a belt but then aranged the ore crushers around the liquifiers (3 top, 3 bottoms). That way inserters can insert directly into them. Makes more sense since the ore cruses have more output than input.

I suplement the sulfuric loop with the sulphuric something gas from the first washing step and went the rest, create grass from the mud, throw away the pure water excess and convert the crushed stone from ore (the actual ore you produce) crushing for landfill. Might be better to make mineralized water out of it for some more power so ore production never stops because some chest is full.

Zephyrinius wrote:

For the new Angels Bioprocessing one needs to collect some gardens, which one can find on some islands. Unfortunately all islands seem to be desert so I only have found desert gardens so far. There are also temperate and swamp gardens which don't grow in the desert.

I thought the same as you, but after going further from the spawn I found temperate and swamp gardens. They're very rare, but they exist -- and once you get some, you can grow more seeds from those, of course.

I tried that in sandbox mode and I had to go far, really far to find just one swamp garden. Further out I mostly only found gardens on islands with cliffs. Everything else is full of aliens.

So yeah, you can find the gardens. It's just a lot of exploring and fighting involved. Not sure yet about the balance. Have to play it in real but my feeling is that it will be too hard to get them.

Finndibaenn wrote:

jonhwoods wrote:[*] Is it possible to use a tool like [https://bitbucket.org/Nicksaurus/forem ... 's Foreman to plan ratios and production lines? I could not manage to make that tool work, and resorted on extensive time consuming Excel sheets instead.[/*]

I'm using Helmod plugin for this

Wow, this is great stuff. Helped me figure out which was the most efficient carbon cycle energy generation between burning Carbon or directly Charcoal. It's a bit complicated to figure out since you need to account for the small amount of CO2 needed for Carbon. Here's the result:

1.828 MW to get 6 MW of Carbon (1 Carbon/s)
1.836 MW to get 6 MW of Charcoal (1.2 Charcoal/s)
Both actually produce 3 MW with the Mk1 burner at 50% efficiency, for a total of ~1.2 MW production using 4 farms and 2 electrolyser.

The best thing about this kind of tool is that you don't have to second guess all the recipe ratios you would input into a spreadsheet. Thanks for sharing that mod, I'll probably always use it going forward!




(Some numbers are rounded up)

Has anyone come across a working .16 version of Science Cost Tweaker that we can use with this Seablock Pack to give the updated recipes?

I am enjoying the latest version of Seablock but am sorely missing the complicated recipes from SCT that I used on the .15 version

Thanks!

There's an updated version here. It works with Angels Bio Processing:
viewtopic.php?f=91&t=14294&start=180#p334229

Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

Are you sure about trees? Not gardens but trees. I had to go insanely far to find swamp and temperate gardens in a sandbox but never saw trees.

What are trees needed for?

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

So have you actually seen one to confirm this? I've searched for ages, and I've got hundreds of gardens now, still no trees. I'd like to know whether this is a wild goose chase, or the time I'm putting in will get rewarded eventually.

If they do exist and are this stupidly rare, then they shouldn't be. Being this rare, they might as well not exist.

mrvn wrote:

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

Are you sure about trees? Not gardens but trees. I had to go insanely far to find swamp and temperate gardens in a sandbox but never saw trees.

What are trees needed for?

You can build aboretums, have a look in the tech tree.

khalgregar wrote:

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

So have you actually seen one to confirm this? I've searched for ages, and I've got hundreds of gardens now, still no trees. I'd like to know whether this is a wild goose chase, or the time I'm putting in will get rewarded eventually.

If they do exist and are this stupidly rare, then they shouldn't be. Being this rare, they might as well not exist.

Following up on this, I've had a poke around in the mod scripts, and as far as I can tell trees are not placed. The scripts set 'autoplace' to nil for all tree prototypes except for the three gardens (which are trees). So unless I'm reading these scripts wrong, I don't know how you've found trees in the world other than the gardens*. I'll assume for now that you misunderstood and thought I was talking about gardens

*I could be reading the scripts very wrong, this is the first time I've looked at them and they could work differently than I'm assuming.

Another update on the trees - I altered my local mod scripts slightly to not erase the 'autoplace' tables from 'swamp-tree' and 'temperate-tree', and I have lots of trees now (in a new game). In fact, there's far too many of them, so the probability needs lowering. Just a FYI for the mod author, if you're keeping the tree tech in Seablock then you probably should allow the trees to appear in the world. Personally, I'd like the trees and the ability to build arboretums

khalgregar wrote:

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

So have you actually seen one to confirm this? I've searched for ages, and I've got hundreds of gardens now, still no trees. I'd like to know whether this is a wild goose chase, or the time I'm putting in will get rewarded eventually.

If they do exist and are this stupidly rare, then they shouldn't be. Being this rare, they might as well not exist.

Sorry, read too quickly. Thought you meant gardens

Sea block doesn't spawn any trees. I'm not sure how to best handle arboretums.

Option 1: Do nothing. No trees, no arboretums.
This is the current option. Remove arboretum techs from tech tree, there's no way to build them anyway.

Option 2: Spawn a few temperate and swamp trees scattered out among the worms.
Don't like this option, it's not how resources work in sea block. e.g. Finding one tree lets you build one arboretum, which then produces wood at a constant rate. Compare to finding one (non seablock) oil patch, which lets you build one pumpjack that then produces oil at a constant(eventually) rate. The idea with seablock is to remove all searching for resources, if you need more production then just copy and paste an existing production element. No need to find more ore patches/oil/trees etc.

Option 3a: Spawn a few rare trees, change recipes so unlimited arboretums can be built after finding one tree.
Reduce arboretum speed so they produce a similar amount of cellulose fiber as an equivalent (space and power consumption) algae farm setup.

Option 3b: Spawn a few rare trees, change recipes so unlimited arboretums can be built after finding one tree.
Increase energy consumption of arboretums so they consume more energy than can be extracted from the output wood. This would make arboretums a late game cellulose fiber option, practical after building a power plant big enough that energy efficiency is no longer a problem.

None of the above options seems that great to me, so I'll stick with option 1 for the moment.

Trainwreck wrote:Sea block doesn't spawn any trees. I'm not sure how to best handle arboretums.

Option 1: Do nothing. No trees, no arboretums.
This is the current option. Remove arboretum techs from tech tree, there's no way to build them anyway.

Option 2: Spawn a few temperate and swamp trees scattered out among the worms.
Don't like this option, it's not how resources work in sea block. e.g. Finding one tree lets you build one arboretum, which then produces wood at a constant rate. Compare to finding one (non seablock) oil patch, which lets you build one pumpjack that then produces oil at a constant(eventually) rate. The idea with seablock is to remove all searching for resources, if you need more production then just copy and paste an existing production element. No need to find more ore patches/oil/trees etc.

Option 3a: Spawn a few rare trees, change recipes so unlimited arboretums can be built after finding one tree.
Reduce arboretum speed so they produce a similar amount of cellulose fiber as an equivalent (space and power consumption) algae farm setup.

Option 3b: Spawn a few rare trees, change recipes so unlimited arboretums can be built after finding one tree.
Increase energy consumption of arboretums so they consume more energy than can be extracted from the output wood. This would make arboretums a late game cellulose fiber option, practical after building a power plant big enough that energy efficiency is no longer a problem.

None of the above options seems that great to me, so I'll stick with option 1 for the moment.

Damn, I played with the arboretums for a bit and they were great for producing boards. Never mind

I wouldn't have bothered with trees if the tech hadn't been available, which led me to wasting a significant number of hours trying to find some trees. Best you take the arboretum techs out, otherwise people will be wasting their time.

Thanks for the response, love seablock!

khalgregar wrote:

mrvn wrote:

Theaisa wrote:

khalgregar wrote:Do temperate and swamp trees exist at all in seablock? I've explored a long way out from my base in all directions, and I now have loads of desert, temperate and swamp gardens, but I'm yet to see a single tree.

Yes, but they are stupidly rare :/

Are you sure about trees? Not gardens but trees. I had to go insanely far to find swamp and temperate gardens in a sandbox but never saw trees.

What are trees needed for?

You can build aboretums, have a look in the tech tree.

I did noticed aboretums when I tried to figure out how to make plastic using FNEI but couldn't find them in the tech tree. Searching for aboretum just gives an empty list (or I mistyped it). Can you check what you have to search for in the tech tree so it shows up please?

There are many ways to create plastic late in the game with many complex chains, loops and waste products.

But what do you think is the simplest way to get your first plastic bar?

This is just to get some plastic for e.g. LTN train stations. Dumping waste products into chests, tanks, clarifiers or flare stacks is totally encouraged. Feeding common items like iron ore or cellulose fibers from a chest is cool too. A belt is preferred. Correct ratios can be totally ignored as this setup should use a minimal amount of resources (including techs) to build.

The goal is simplicity, not efficiency.

Note: I have a setup using farms from bioindustries with many intermediates. Will post it after a while so I don't influence others too much.

mrvn wrote: But what do you think is the simplest way to get your first plastic bar?

I'm pretty sure the simplest way is just Cellulose>Methanol>Propene>Plastic

You get a small amount of Residual Gas byproduct which I flared, although many hours later I now need it to make Fuel Oil out of Lubricant byproducts.

jonhwoods wrote:

mrvn wrote: I'm pretty sure the simplest way is just Cellulose>Methanol>Propene>Plastic

Agreed.

Just an additional note, because its a tiny bit more complicated:
If you already have some aluminium and silver ore, then Methanol from CO2 + Hydrogen + Green Metal Catalysts seems to produce twice the amount and its much smaller.