[MOD 0.18] Robot Army. v0.4.4

Topics and discussion about specific mods
kyranzor
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Re: [MOD 0.14.7] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

Hey Mr Grim, sorry about the delay, i've been super busy. I'll check out your save game some time in the next few days!

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MrGrim
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Re: [MOD 0.14.7] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by MrGrim »

kyranzor wrote:Hey Mr Grim, sorry about the delay, i've been super busy. I'll check out your save game some time in the next few days!
No worries! Thank you!

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Re: [MOD 0.14.7] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

It looks like you had some code from the 0.2.4 preview/github code, and there was a strange state for those squads. If you do this:

/c for i,j in pairs(game.player.surface.find_entities_filtered({name="rally-beacon", force=game.player.force})) do if (j and j.valid) then j.destroy() end end


Then it will destroy your rally beacon/s (any on the map) and it made the units stop being stuck and start doing things again. For some reason, they just finally accepted the path to the rally beacon and started moving all that distance to where it used to be. I think it's because the long distance path finding took soo long that when the rally beacon sent the next rally-pulse command (every 3 seconds I believe) it just made the squads re-start the path finding process (so they never actually finished the path request)

Be aware that some of the 0.2.4 code in it's current state could cause unknown/bad state for squads and their AI. If you do add some work-in-progress code from the github, then be aware it might break squads that are already deployed or droid assemblers might need to be picked up and put down again. It depends what/how we've changed the global tables and how data is recorded for the mod.

Anyway do what I mentioned earlier and it will un-stuck your squads.

edit: in fact, from the save-game you sent me, just remove the rally point right next to the player and on old 0.2.3 (stable release) the squads immediately fix themselves. I can't know exactly what combination of data/events caused the squads to become stuck originally but it looks to me like the rally point was just too far away for the path-finding to work fast enough before the next move-to-position request (causing a new pathfinder sequence). This is a pretty huge map (168 hours played!) and the distances are more than I ever tested on, so I haven't seen this particular issue before. It seems to me that increasing the rally point pulse frequency to 10 seconds might be reasonable to fix this. If you indicate to me which version of the mod you are using specifically, I can point you to the line of code to change the time between rally point pulses and see if that helps in your situations.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.7] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by MrGrim »

kyranzor wrote:edit: in fact, from the save-game you sent me, just remove the rally point right next to the player and on old 0.2.3 (stable release) the squads immediately fix themselves. I can't know exactly what combination of data/events caused the squads to become stuck originally but it looks to me like the rally point was just too far away for the path-finding to work fast enough before the next move-to-position request (causing a new pathfinder sequence). This is a pretty huge map (168 hours played!) and the distances are more than I ever tested on, so I haven't seen this particular issue before. It seems to me that increasing the rally point pulse frequency to 10 seconds might be reasonable to fix this. If you indicate to me which version of the mod you are using specifically, I can point you to the line of code to change the time between rally point pulses and see if that helps in your situations.
Later on I did remove the rally point and noticed they all started moving again. Most of them never quite made it and got stuck again at some point in their journey. Placing a rally point then removing it again would "zap" them again. I used this trick a few times to get them to behave.

I started with 0.2.3, then later removed the mod and played for a few more hours, then installed the most current git revision prior to the save you looked at. All entities in the save should have been created entirely inside that 0.2.4 git copy.

The squads were idle for several minutes prior to placing the rally point. Unfortunately, I didn't think to get a save then. I haven't played in a few days, but this weekend I intend to use the droids to take a large chunk of land on the west side of that map roughly equal in size to the southwest area that they were clearing for me in the save I provided. I expect at some point squads will exhibit the same behavior. I'll try to make it as easy for you as I can and grab saves while standing nearby the idle squads when that happens.

If there's more I can do to help provide you the data you need let me know.

Thanks!

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by xbeo »

MrGrim wrote:
Later on I did remove the rally point and noticed they all started moving again. Most of them never quite made it and got stuck again at some point in their journey. Placing a rally point then removing it again would "zap" them again. I used this trick a few times to get them to behave.
Thank you, this helped me a lot.

Do you also notice a slight stutter/lag when you squads merge into huge armies?

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

I run into the problem that the robots at some point stop moving and standing afk in my base or in a forrest... what iam doin wrong? I limited the robots to 80. But they already cleared a big distance (i didnt set any limit) any idea?

Couldnt you just implement "if idle 20 min then despawn"

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

nuhll wrote:I run into the problem that the robots at some point stop moving and standing afk in my base or in a forrest... what iam doin wrong? I limited the robots to 80. But they already cleared a big distance (i didnt set any limit) any idea?

Couldnt you just implement "if idle 20 min then despawn"
There might be no biters left or the biters are too far away. or the squad is trying to find a path to biters on an island and can't get there.

Increase the hunting radius using settings module or re-deploy the droids further away from your factory, closer to the biters. If there no biters left, go explore the map to generate more biters.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

There are biters, but they wont go to it. Also i set the builder near, and then new deployed work correct.

Cant you just add this config somewhere? I dont want to mess with every point on the map.. lol

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

There is a config for this, in the config.lua file, and also available in game using the Droid Settings Module special combinator and associated virtual signals you set which you can read more about on the github wiki.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

I mean make them despawn or refresh or what ever is best. to make them atleast suicide. From 80 bots atleast 60 are everyhwere on the map in groups sometimes 1 sometimes 2.... and even if i collect, new will start afk somewhere at some time. mod is not useable atm.
Last edited by nuhll on Thu Oct 27, 2016 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

Have you tried using a rally beacon? It will command all droids to move to it and you can pick them up there and deal with it.

Then go and set up the droid assemblers closer to biters.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

No i didnt tried. Will try it. But anyway, i dont want to babysit them... (isnt automation the deal in this game? ;))

Cant they just be respawned to base or something if there are no enemys or they afk (on my map they afked while there were enemyies). Or a rally point which only attracks bots which afk for X time?

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

Perhaps. There are simple but tacky ways to do this, i'd like to make sure it's simple but not silly like just instantly dying/wiping out the bots. If they retreat and convert themselves back into an item into the army loot crate that might be good and simple.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

Yeah taht sounds good, btw the rally point worked!

It might be that enemys are too far away, but still, i see them on map, so i thought it should work. Maybe make it possible (with module or something) to only spawn if enemys around, and if not, go back to chest (when afk 5 min), or maybe some fancy inserter :P

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by nuhll »

Btw, what do you think about "worker robots" constructing outposts on ore fields and your robot army protect them? :)

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Mylon
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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by Mylon »

Some features I'd like:


* Victory turrets. After clearing a nest, either a new robot (turret placement robot) or any particular robot converts into a turret to stay behind and kill any other creeps that try to reestablish the base. This automates holding territory instead of perpetually clearing the same nests over and over.
* Supply bot. Scans turrets and brings ammo to them. Way to keep victory turrets topped off.
* Support bot. I know you would like bots that need to be resupplied but this would make it more playable as they would fetch fuel/ammo/repair packs for the rest of the squad. Fetches supplies from the nearest Army Supply Chest.
* Repair bot. Uses repair packs on nearby bots.
* Hotkeys. Make squad size changeable in game. Either use one global setting or could store settings per player (and check last_user for their squad size setting)


Balance remarks:
* Squads of 5 feel too weak. Squads of 20 feel really strong. Maybe less range so larger numbers of bots are less effective. Also, squad size could be a research. And/or controller robot which provides extra supply capacity.
* Maybe make them available a bit later? Require engines and/or advanced circuits.

I can do some of these on my own and you'll probably see me on git. But I'm curious if anyone else has feedback on these ideas.

Edit: Updated squad size idea.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by Mylon »

Idea: Robot platform. Built from engines, cogs, and steel, and circuits. Armor + platform + weapon produces the specific bot.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by kyranzor »

nuhll wrote:Btw, what do you think about "worker robots" constructing outposts on ore fields and your robot army protect them? :)
Maybe - I want to have mining robots that walk around ore fields and then come back to deposit the ores. Maybe a guard squad can be deployed with them at the same time.
Mylon wrote: * Victory turrets. After clearing a nest, either a new robot (turret placement robot) or any particular robot converts into a turret to stay behind and kill any other creeps that try to reestablish the base. This automates holding territory instead of perpetually clearing the same nests over and over.
* Supply bot. Scans turrets and brings ammo to them. Way to keep victory turrets topped off.
* Support bot. I know you would like bots that need to be resupplied but this would make it more playable as they would fetch fuel/ammo/repair packs for the rest of the squad. Fetches supplies from the nearest Army Supply Chest.
* Repair bot. Uses repair packs on nearby bots.
* Hotkeys. Make squad size changeable in game. Either use one global setting or could store settings per player (and check last_user for their squad size setting)

Balance remarks:
* Squads of 5 feel too weak. Squads of 20 feel really strong. Maybe less range so larger numbers of bots are less effective. Also, squad size could be a research. And/or controller robot which provides extra supply capacity.
* Maybe make them available a bit later? Require engines and/or advanced circuits.
VIctory Turrets - perhaps when nests are killed they can be plotted as candidates for a outpost-building-team? A robot that acts like a mobile building deployment to pop down a turret or two and some droids to defend the area?

The supply/suppot/repair bot is an all-in-one combo I want to make out of the "Engineer bot" which will be coming soon. can go in a squad as a medic or be placed around your base to do the resupply/repair tasks.

I want to use hotkeys for squad controls eventually. Also an RTS mode like the satellite/orbital relay mod by Supercheese.

I really like starcraft memes, so I think i'll make a population control building like a "pylon" (or house in Age of Empires 2) that just linearly scales up your max number of droids. Maybe a simple gui text area can show current/max pop.

I want droids to be useable by the player pretty early, and the current tech progression is okay for now. I am adding special tech for robot army rather than using vanilla tech, so that might help what you are talking about?

Finally, the way Factorio entities and definitions work, I can't really make use of a generic "platform" style of building a robot. They still have to be hard-coded and have specific artwork and icons etc made for them, so i'd like to keep it with rigidly defined robot types for now. I currently offer 5 land-based robots and 3 air-based robots for players, surely that's enough?

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by Mylon »

To clarify, the robot platform was just a recipe idea. Bringing a weapon, armor, and additional materials together gets a bit complicated. Making platforms reusable across droids (specifically smg and flamethrower, maybe the to-come engineer) would be a nice way to simplify construction.

This is what I had in mind for victory turrets: https://github.com/kyranf/robotarmyfact ... 640c69cc77

This works out great because now bots will not just wipe enemy bases but also hold territory automatically.

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Re: [MOD 0.14.14] Robot Army. 0.2.3

Post by Mylon »

Do you have anything yet for the engineer bot? I might be able to program it but I don't want to re-invent the wheel.

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