[MOD 0.17.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

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TheSAguy
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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:43 pm

naquada wrote:
TheSAguy wrote:V7.2.2 Should fix the Artifact Collector Issue.
Let me know,
Thanks to Orz!elek
Hey,

Update fixed the problem. However the server became very unstable after that update and players went into desync loops to such degree that we had to remove the mod.
After removing it performance went up big time. Our server has around 40-50 mods on it. Anything that we can do to help solve the issue?
Sorry to hear that naquada.
Is anyone else experiencing this in MP? I don't play MP so can't test this.

Thanks.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:50 pm

V7.2.5 - NE Buildings: Hopefully this fixes the A.C. Lag and Terraforming Station Crash!

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by naquada » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:36 pm

TheSAguy wrote:V7.2.5 - NE Buildings: Hopefully this fixes the A.C. Lag and Terraforming Station Crash!
Your update seems to have fixed the issues in our multiplayer server. Great job :)

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by Florian1024 » Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:26 am

hello,
First very cool mod, I really like it!
But, I have an issue with Natural Evolution Expansion last version who at 5% of evolution simply cover the entire map with an high density of mob spawner in less than 5min.
This is killing my game and I was forced to turn it off (see mod-list.json).
Could you fix it please.
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mod-list.json
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TheSAguy
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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:24 pm

Florian1024 wrote:hello,
First very cool mod, I really like it!
But, I have an issue with Natural Evolution Expansion last version who at 5% of evolution simply cover the entire map with an high density of mob spawner in less than 5min.
This is killing my game and I was forced to turn it off (see mod-list.json).
Could you fix it please.
I've not had that experience, but I've made some tweaks to 7.0.6.
Hopefully that should help.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by sp518 » Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:09 pm

I have been 2 weeks don't play this game. And then I update the mods and delete the Endgamecombat. And when I begin walking around my home, Booom by save crashed. It's the same problem I post 2 week before. How can I save my saves. :cry:

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:54 pm

sp518 wrote:I have been 2 weeks don't play this game. And then I update the mods and delete the Endgamecombat. And when I begin walking around my home, Booom by save crashed. It's the same problem I post 2 week before. How can I save my saves. :cry:
Just sent you a fixed Save. Let me know if you have a later one you'd like me to fix.
Thanks.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by sp518 » Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:14 am

TheSAguy wrote:
sp518 wrote:I have been 2 weeks don't play this game. And then I update the mods and delete the Endgamecombat. And when I begin walking around my home, Booom by save crashed. It's the same problem I post 2 week before. How can I save my saves. :cry:
Just sent you a fixed Save. Let me know if you have a later one you'd like me to fix.
Thanks.
Many thanks. I will try it later. May I known how to fix or whats wrong with it?

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by piccolo255 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:10 am

First of all, thanks for great mods! :)

I'd like to report an incompatibility between NE Buildings and Endgame Combat.
Shortly after adding EC I got a crash. Did a bit of source spelunking and I think I found the problem.

Recap of my understanding of relevant NE code:
Terraforming Stations in NE are using a turret entity to hold ammo, and an invisible radar entity whose periodic scan fires the terraforming event Reduce_Evolution. This event also reads and modifies the turrent entity, the reference to which is stored in the global.Terraforming_Station_Table

Recap of my understanding of relevant EC code:
Endgame Combat has a tech for increasing turret range. It does this by replacing all turrets with increased range versions (I guess that the API doesn't support dynamically changing range). The increased version object prototypes are created programmatically, by going through all turrets, modifying their name and range, and adding as a new prototype.

Incompatibility:
I think you see where this is going. After researching the increased range tech, "Terraforming Station" was replaced by "Terraforming Station [Range Boost 1]", which invalidated the reference stored in global.Terraforming_Station_Table[].inventory. The next time a terraforming event fired, the map crashed with this stacktrace:

Code: Select all

Error while running event Natural_Evolution_Buildings::on_sector_scanned (ID 7)
LuaEntity API call when LuaEntity was invalid.
stack traceback:
	__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:594: in function 'Reduce_Evolution'
	__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:652: in function <__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:646>
To make matters worse, removing the upgraded Station didn't help, since the newly placed entity didn't trigger the NE removal code. Reverting to an earlier save (before tech was researched), removing all Stations, and never placing a new one, is the only workaround that I can think of to use both mods.

Suggestions:
Frankly, I don't have any good ones.

1) Try to detect the entity change and update the references. I don't know Lua or Factorio modding API, so I don't know if this is feasible.

2) Register On_Built, On_Remove, On_Death event handlers to also fire for other types of entity addition/removal. Again, I don't know if it's feasible. Also, entities with increased range will have different names :/

3) Special detection code for Endgame Combat that disables range increase for Terraforming Station. Seems like a lot of work, and could break any time EC updates.

4) Change building type of the Terraforming Station. EC generates range-increased versions for object types "ammo-turret", "electric-turret", "fluid-turret". Station is designated as "ammo-turret", so it gets the treatment. Again, could be a lot of work for very little gain.

5) Mark Endgame Turrets as incompatible with NE Buildings so that those mods can't be used together. Don't know if it can be done, and other stuff seems to not have any conflicts (for now; I only added EC a little while ago). I'd also like to use both, so I don't like this possibility :)

6) Warn users that a combination of Terraforming Stations and EC range increase tech will crash the game and shouldn't be used together. Essentially, pushing the responsibility on the players. I like this one better than #5 :)

Sorry for the wall-of-text, I wanted to report my findings since it could help if someone else encounters the same problem. Thanks again for NE!

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:48 pm

piccolo255 wrote:First of all, thanks for great mods! :)

I'd like to report an incompatibility between NE Buildings and Endgame Combat.
Shortly after adding EC I got a crash. Did a bit of source spelunking and I think I found the problem.

Recap of my understanding of relevant NE code:
Terraforming Stations in NE are using a turret entity to hold ammo, and an invisible radar entity whose periodic scan fires the terraforming event Reduce_Evolution. This event also reads and modifies the turrent entity, the reference to which is stored in the global.Terraforming_Station_Table

Recap of my understanding of relevant EC code:
Endgame Combat has a tech for increasing turret range. It does this by replacing all turrets with increased range versions (I guess that the API doesn't support dynamically changing range). The increased version object prototypes are created programmatically, by going through all turrets, modifying their name and range, and adding as a new prototype.

Incompatibility:
I think you see where this is going. After researching the increased range tech, "Terraforming Station" was replaced by "Terraforming Station [Range Boost 1]", which invalidated the reference stored in global.Terraforming_Station_Table[].inventory. The next time a terraforming event fired, the map crashed with this stacktrace:

Code: Select all

Error while running event Natural_Evolution_Buildings::on_sector_scanned (ID 7)
LuaEntity API call when LuaEntity was invalid.
stack traceback:
	__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:594: in function 'Reduce_Evolution'
	__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:652: in function <__Natural_Evolution_Buildings__/control.lua:646>
To make matters worse, removing the upgraded Station didn't help, since the newly placed entity didn't trigger the NE removal code. Reverting to an earlier save (before tech was researched), removing all Stations, and never placing a new one, is the only workaround that I can think of to use both mods.

Suggestions:
Frankly, I don't have any good ones.

1) Try to detect the entity change and update the references. I don't know Lua or Factorio modding API, so I don't know if this is feasible.

2) Register On_Built, On_Remove, On_Death event handlers to also fire for other types of entity addition/removal. Again, I don't know if it's feasible. Also, entities with increased range will have different names :/

3) Special detection code for Endgame Combat that disables range increase for Terraforming Station. Seems like a lot of work, and could break any time EC updates.

4) Change building type of the Terraforming Station. EC generates range-increased versions for object types "ammo-turret", "electric-turret", "fluid-turret". Station is designated as "ammo-turret", so it gets the treatment. Again, could be a lot of work for very little gain.

5) Mark Endgame Turrets as incompatible with NE Buildings so that those mods can't be used together. Don't know if it can be done, and other stuff seems to not have any conflicts (for now; I only added EC a little while ago). I'd also like to use both, so I don't like this possibility :)

6) Warn users that a combination of Terraforming Stations and EC range increase tech will crash the game and shouldn't be used together. Essentially, pushing the responsibility on the players. I like this one better than #5 :)

Sorry for the wall-of-text, I wanted to report my findings since it could help if someone else encounters the same problem. Thanks again for NE!
Thanks piccolo,
I think you've hit the nail on the head here!

I'm also not entirely 100% sure how to fix this, I think sometimes certain mods are just not compatible with each other. As much as I love coding, I'm not a strong coder and am not going to spen a lot of time trying to fix this. I like your idea off looking if EC is installed and displaying a warning message to the user. Will do that on the next release.

Thanks again for looking into this a little deeper.
Last edited by TheSAguy on Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by orzelek » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:32 pm

You can't really fix this.
Endgame Combat would need to have blacklist to avoaid modifying of hidden turret entity.

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Re: [MOD 0.12.x | 0.13.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien! - 6.2.1

Post by Berkys32 » Wed Aug 23, 2017 8:09 am

Demosthenex wrote:
TheSAguy wrote:
Nexela wrote:
Nexela wrote:
Berkys32 wrote:I dont know why, but Artifact collector cant be picked using "Picker" mod or even build via blueprint or removed with deconstruction planner
As to "picker" This is because the "placed" collector does not have an item-prototype associated with it. I will shoot the author of picker the fix for that shortly.

And I have a fix for blueprint/deconstruction which still allows the range circle but it now shows up as a chest correctly :)
You are right about the prototype.
This fix you have, is it needed on my end or "picker" mod end?
Was this fix implemented? I'm using Natural_Evolution_Enemies_6.4.0.zip and still can't place collectors via blueprint. Thanks!
Ummmmmm... Was this fixed? I still cant place or remove Aritfactl collectors via BP or deconstruction planner...

EDIT: I cant even use Pipette tool on it and it doesnt snap to building grid vhen in hand...

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by zoolie » Thu Aug 24, 2017 8:47 am

Hey,
I'm 127 hours into a game with your mod and while I'm still enjoying it, it's feeling like a little bit of a grind. I think to an extent thats probably my fault; I didn't focus enough on limiting pollution early on but the result is now that anywhere outside my base walls is covered with xeno to the extent that any expansion has to be done with a slow creep using biocannons and a cubic crapton of turrets.

Image

It's only my second game of factorio at all, and like I said I screwed up by not managing pollution better, but I'd welcome any advice on how to expand to resources slightly quicker at this stage in the game. (My save is here if interested)

For feedback, I think it'd be nice to have a few more options at this stage of the game to push back the aliens slightly faster and be a bit less grindy. Or perhaps, if it's by design that I've trapped myself by overpolluting early game, that the aliens put me out of my misery and crush me completely rather than it being a stalemate .

In any case thanks for the mod. I was bored stupid with the standard aliens, and this at least makes them a challenge!

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:06 pm

V7.3.0 - NE Buildings - Added new turrets, added conversion ammo. Lot's of changes... Need feedback

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by Ratzap » Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:11 pm

zoolie wrote:Hey,
I'm 127 hours into a game with your mod and while I'm still enjoying it, it's feeling like a little bit of a grind. I think to an extent thats probably my fault; I didn't focus enough on limiting pollution early on but the result is now that anywhere outside my base walls is covered with xeno to the extent that any expansion has to be done with a slow creep using biocannons and a cubic crapton of turrets.
You have a couple of choices. Either start using nukes or use console commands to a) stop expansion and b) destroy all biters plus nests on the map.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:56 pm

Ratzap wrote:
zoolie wrote:Hey,
I'm 127 hours into a game with your mod and while I'm still enjoying it, it's feeling like a little bit of a grind. I think to an extent thats probably my fault; I didn't focus enough on limiting pollution early on but the result is now that anywhere outside my base walls is covered with xeno to the extent that any expansion has to be done with a slow creep using biocannons and a cubic crapton of turrets.
You have a couple of choices. Either start using nukes or use console commands to a) stop expansion and b) destroy all biters plus nests on the map.
I've added some toys in 7.3.0 that should also help.
Also, give the Alien Control Station a shot.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by Berkys32 » Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:31 pm

Artifact collector still not patched.
When I try to pick up Long range turret, it dissapear instead of apperaing in my inventory.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by TheSAguy » Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:06 pm

Berkys32 wrote:Artifact collector still not patched.
What do you mean? Blue-prints? The AC can't be put into blue-prints since I use a turret entity to show the radius and then switch that out.
Berkys32 wrote: When I try to pick up Long range turret, it dissapear instead of apperaing in my inventory.
Thanks! Update 7.3.3. Fixes this.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by zoolie » Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:54 am

Ratzap wrote: You have a couple of choices. Either start using nukes or use console commands to a) stop expansion and b) destroy all biters plus nests on the map.
The console is no fun! I'm determined to beat it without resorting to that. Thought about nukes but I'd need to expand to some more uranium first and even then I'm not sure I'll be able to produce enough to clear a reasonable path.
TheSAguy wrote: I've added some toys in 7.3.0 that should also help.
Also, give the Alien Control Station a shot.
I'll try them, I've been using a bunch of control stations but I can't say I've noticed much impact yet. I've also got a mass of friendly spitter and biter spawners, but they're hand to wrangle to do anything useful. It'd be useful if there were more options than just attract, maybe something like the controller from programmable vehicles.

I also added the aircraft mod and the power armor mk3 mod to give me more combat options, which does at least let me get out there and fight a bit without getting smashed immediately, but still can't tackle the shear scale of the enemy lol. Might try using programmable vehicles to automate waves of aircraft against the enemy, but its just so resource expensive!

I only just noticed you've modded the rails to be ignored by biters which could be handy. Up until know I've been expanding the outer wall of my base to encompass everything thinking I wouldn't be able to run rails in the open. That being said, the practicalities of running the rails and doing the initial outpost base build with so many beasties about will probably mean I still need to keep expanding the turret wall till I get to the resources.

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Re: [MOD 0.15.x] Natural Evolution - All things Alien!

Post by Berkys32 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:08 am

I suggest AAI programmable vehicles, bobs vehicles and bobs vehicle equipment grid. Nothing is better than buch of tanks full of lasers roaming through spawners like knife through butter!

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