jonatkins wrote: dragontamer5788 wrote:
jonatkins wrote:Now, this ONE SINGLE PART of the logistics system has been moved far ahead of the rest of the system in terms of research requirements. It just doesn't make sense.
Why not? Its clearly the most powerful system in the game. Requester Chests literally solves all
the problems in the game to such a gross degree that they trivialize design.
That's something I just don't get. Yes, they trivialise a low-volume
production route, but anything with large volumes is far easier to keep on belts I find.
A blue-belt can only move 40-items per second. You can fit an infinite number of bots into any particular space, meaning bots are only
limited by the charging stations (IE: The density of 4MW Roboports). Each roboport can support roughly 800-tiles of movement per second. If you have multiple Roboports charging in parallel, you can achieve the most throughput in the game in the smallest amount of space. Ex: four roboports support 3200-tiles of movement per second (16MWs used). As such, Logistic Bots are THE BEST
way to load and unload from Trains... especially since Stack Inserters are far faster from Chest -> Wagon than Belt -> Wagon.
Tell me, have you ever put 4000 Logistic robots in a Roboport network? Because that basically solves every problem in the game. There are a few issues that come up (including the ridiculously dumb AI that visits chests even though they're full...), but once you get used to the quirks, its clear that Logistic Networks solve literally every problem in the game.
You just gotta split up logistic networks in an intelligent manner to mitigate the dumb-quirk issues. Its a good idea to have an isolated network for train offloading, so that the "visits already full chests" problem is mitigated. The "visits full chests" issue only really comes up in train-stations (when big deliveries of ~8000 or 16000 ore from 4-cargo or 8-cargo trains arrive. The Bots all
visit the same chest, even if chests can only hold 2400 ore). And aside from that, you need to have an understanding of the MW-limitations of bots. Bots use energy every tile they move, so the power-requirements of logistic bots can be large (requiring a large number of Roboports to deliver power effectively).
The only time I use belts are when I'm sure an area won't expand beyond 40-items per second... maybe 80-items per second if I'm willing to lay down double-wide belts. But if I'm building an area with more traffic than that... Bots are the only
solution available in the endgame.
And, with all of this production rate - there's 500 logistics bots, and most of them are idle unlless I've ordered construction or return to the base for re-supply.
500 is a ludicrously low number. I have 500 bots per logistic area, and over 4000-bots in my main area. And I don't even consider my base to be a "Megabase" yet... not compared to what everyone else around here is doing anyway.
Lets see... my major logistic areas are:
1. My main area of ~4000 bots (I was lazy and designed it poorly. Its due for a refactoring).
2. My Iron Smelters: ~500 bots that deliver from train to belt. I'm only serving 120-iron per second so... its sufficient for now
3. My Copper Smelters: ~500 bots again for the same purpose. Only 120 copper per second, so I don't need many bots.
4. My Circuit / Adv. Circuit area: ~1500 bots in a "lazy" configuration.
My "northern thrust" is composed of isolated Logistic / Construction Networks that automatically pass walls, electric poles, laser turrets, chests, inserters, logistic bots, and roboports further and further north (a train delivers raw supplies to the supply, but logistic bots deliver all items north. Long-inserters passing from Requester Chests -> Provider chests separate the logistic networks to ensure that the network doesn't suffer from "dumb AI" issues). Each of these are composed of ~20 logistic bots. (I needed the long-inserters so that they can read from the logistic network's wireless item count and perform logic on that. I only want to store ~5 laser turrets in each 50x50 construction area)
I mean seriously: with decent design powers, you can literally solve every issue in the game. Self-building laser walls (I stamp down blueprints using map-view and then logistic bots deliver the supplies... including construction bots... which then automatically build the next +50 tiles that explores northward)... offloading from trains, giant piles of assembly machines with Requester Chests / Provider Chests automatically pulling everything. Logistic bots literally solve every problem in the game in a ridiculously effective manner, obsoleting everything else by huge margins except for trains.