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The +50% on biochambers is nice, but they have to be fed nutrients, which are produced 50% spoiled, in order to function. Forcing biochambers for viability just increases the need to rely on robots instead of traditional production/belts, given how far apart the biomes are - at least on my map. Just moving things close to somewhere central with belts is resulting in product arriving over half spoiled already.

This is pretty unforgiving and really not very fun.

there is an ingame setting during map generation to increase the spoilage time

mmmPI wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 1:01 pm there is an ingame setting during map generation to increase the spoilage time

"Balancing" is about the changes that may work better for all players with the default setting. Extreme players can reduce this setting for themselves.

coppercoil wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 1:08 pm

mmmPI wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 1:01 pm there is an ingame setting during map generation to increase the spoilage time

"Balancing" is about the changes that may work better for all players with the default setting. Extreme players can reduce this setting for themselves.

This is a succession of generic argument or what ? here is previous copy paste of the original post : viewtopic.php?p=633894#p633894

For the particular topic where this was copy pasted, "spoilage time" there exist possibility to make the default easier or harder. It means if you think it's hard you can try the settings, since there was no mention of it in the original post and this settings seem to adress this question in particular it appeared to me noteworthy to mention it because i think it would work better for "all player" if they started to use the settings made for them but they can't if they are unaware of their existence.

mmmPI wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 1:36 pm

While you are correct in saying that people may be unaware of the setting, posting a topic in "Balancing" doesn't mean "too hard for me", it means "may be too hard for most players." This implies correcting the default setting, not just the ability to set individual settings.

coppercoil wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 2:11 pm While you are correct in saying that people may be unaware of the setting, posting a topic in "Balancing" doesn't mean "too hard for me", it means "may be too hard for most players." This implies correcting the default setting, not just the ability to set individual settings.

It would be a shame that only the people who think it's too hard express their voice, as the balance of the game would be shifted toward only a single direction, especially if it is caused by the lack of knowledge about the options already available to mitigate the thing they may find hard.

Generically increasing spoil time doesn’t make sense, since there are several situations where you need something to spoil before you can use it. Particularly bacteria.

It would be more useful to talk about which timers are too short, if any, and see if they warrant adjustments.

mmmPI wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 2:20 pm

Of course, we expect some discussion here.
Or, this topic may be just N+1 voice saying "Gleba is too hard". There already are many discussions about that. I'd just like to ask more one question: are most players as skilled as those who say "Actually Gleba is good"?

https://mods.factorio.com/mod/spoilage-solution
My vision of problem of spoil.
Canning and freezing.

J-H wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:59 pm […] nutrients, which are produced 50% spoiled, in order to function. […]

This is only true if you limit yourself to making nutrients from spoilage.
Once you have bioflux, you can make nutrients at the same freshness as the bioflux …

That takes a lot more in terms of inputs.

J-H wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2024 4:03 am That takes a lot more in terms of inputs.

It's a bit more complicated, but in terms of resources it's much more efficient - you get 12 nutrients per bioflux using that recipe (accounting for the +50% prod of biochambers), and it's fresh.

It takes 120 spoilage to make that much and it will be halfway spoiled. That takes waaaay more fruit to make than 1 bioflux does.