Armor Batteries are underpowered, give them a boost

[Peter34]

Currently, the Battery MkI can store 1 kJ, and the MkII can store 5 kJ.

I propose boosting that to 3 kJ for the MkI and 10 kJ for the MkII, thta is a tripling for the low tier and a doubling for the high tier. As it is, when using a Runner Modular/Power Armor, fitted with 1 or 2 Exoskoletons, Solar for power and Batteries for power storage, it runs out really, really fast. MkI Batteries are a total joke, not worth using at all, and the MkII ones aren't much better.

I don't consider it a problem if these boosts are associated with a higher material cost to build them. That's not the problem, the problem is the limited space in pre-Fusion Modular Armor and Power Armour, where each Battery takes up 2 tiles out of 25 or 49 without really giving any appreciable benefit. Therefore, a small boost to storage is in order, I think.

[bobingabout]

It's not really the batteries that are a joke, but the solar power being quite crape. How many batteries do you have on your armor?

[Koub]

Imho, batteries have to be seen as "just in punctual case of overconsumption", thus, they are suited for what they're designed.
On the other hand, portable solar panels are really a bad power source : a 4x4 grid of solar panels outputs 160W where a fusion reactor outputs 750. doubling the output from 10W to 20W wouldn't be a bad thing.

[Finndibaenn]

OTOH, figuring a guy running around with enough solar panels to power any significant device is quite funny I guess you can expect Hundreds of square meter worth ...

You'll say that running around with a portable fusion reactor is dubious too ... but it's more SF

[Koub]

Yeah portable fusion reactor seems so unimaginable

[quinor]

Well, that one is much smaller than solar panels! I'd say 1x1 in armor grid

[starholme]

The sun is a reasonably portable fusion reactor. Shouldn't need more than about 1,000,000,000 x 1,000,000,000 tiles in the grid. Provides a boost to solar panels. Keeps the user toasty. Incinerates nearby everything.

On topic, I'd like to see higher tier batteries. Up to the point that it becomes practical to have a 'charging station', and no generation directly in the armor. Stand on the charging station, fill up your batteries, and go.

[Peter34]

I would like to see a Charging Station for my Modular/Power Armor. In my use case, almost all the time I'm well within my base, just moving around, doing stuff inside the base, and annoyed that my Solars won't recharge my Batteries more quickly.

I don't mind if it's expensive. Say, 5 or 10 times as costly as a Roboport. I'd still build 2 or 5, and put them inside my base, just to be able to charge my own Armor faster.



But as for Solars being anemic, yes they are a bit, but in terms of game balance, one must consider the flexibility of using 1x1 Solar relative to the inflexibility of having to use a 4x4 Fusion. So I think 20 watt per Solar is too much, but perhaps increasing them from 15 to 20 would be good.

I still maintain that the Batteries are very weak. Rather than asking for a MkIII and MkIV, my claim is that the MkI Batteries are so weak that they have no legitimate uses. They serve no purpose. That's why I want them boosted from 1 kJ to 3, and the MkII ones boosted a bit less from 5 kJ to 10. Only after that is done can we look at whether or not there is a reasonable case for MkIII Batteries.

[bobingabout]

I think the recipe is the bigger joke really... Combiining 10 MK 1s to make a MK 2, where the capacity is only 5x? Okay, that's not too bad, but for the shield it's only 3x, and still takes 10. I'd personally prefer to see fewer of the previous tier, and more intermediates in the recipe.

Anyway, I think you're right. The capacity of a MK1 battery should probably be around 5kJ, and the MK2 scaled proportionately to 25kJ.

[Peter34]

Another poster has made a mod, implementing my balancing requests, so now you guys can try it out, see if you like it and if you do then support my argument that the vanilla game needs to be re-balanced, to give a slight boost to these 3 techs:
https://forums.factorio.com/forum/vie ... 148#p82086

[matpmag]

Thanks Peter34. any other suggestions or ideas, let me know!

[Nasabot]

I dont know what the bigger problem is: the armor solar panels or the batteries. Both are actually useless, because the fusion reacor is so much better by its numbers.

After a quick thought this is what Id do:

Put together batteries and solar panels to a new device which acts like a self recharging batterie (slow recharge but with buffer). Rebalance all the armor items in a way that the fusion reactor is "similar good" to the recharging batterie, because then the player has 2 defense concepts:

-high EHP (high effective health points, because you have a lot of buffer energy, which gets converted into shield) ->auto recharging batterie
-high regeneration(you dont have buffer energy, but in exchange you have a higher energy recharge rate) ->fusion reactor

I want to note, that the "auto recharging batterie" should be an equally good late game item like the fusion reactor, meaning, that producing it, is a LOT MORE expensive than it is currently now.

Also there could be different shield items, which have different strenghts:
-fast recharging
-high shield HP
-good energy-shield conversion rate

Currently it apears to me, that the armor items do not provide much depth. I think one of the better setups is:

-2 exo skelets
-3 fusion reactor
-remaining space->shield
-night goggles and drone hangar for convenience

Maybe this is not the best setup for every situation, but still there I do not see a way a reason to use armor solar panels. And if you do not use armor solar panels, you will probably wont need batteries. I use 1 batterie, because I have 1x2 space left, its actually useless.

[Peter34]

Check out the Modular Armor ReVamp mod. Actually, you should all check it out, then once you find that it is very much to your liking, we should put collective pressure on the devs to improve the modular armor situation which in both alpha 11 and 12 (I never played 10) is appalling.

[bobucles]

The most important attribute of a suit module is the value it gives per tile of space. Fusion reactors blow solar panels away by being 5 times stronger than a 4x4 grid of solar, plus they work at night so it's more like 8x. Fusion power can also beat out a 4x4 grid of MK2 batteries in about a minute.

What if you want something with really high space efficiency, but not have its benefits stacked to hell? One way is to alter the item's shape. For example lets take two items that both require 12 units of space- a 3x4 block, and a 4x4 hollow box. Using a 10x10 armor grid we can load up with 6 of the compact item, however only 4 of the inflated item can fit. That can make a major difference if the module is particularly powerful. A 5x5 plus shape takes up only 9 tiles, but only 2 of them can fit in an 8x8 grid and the second one will block fusion power. The same grid could have 2 3x3 modules and pack 2 fusion.

Of course you probably shouldn't get too crazy with the tetris. But a module's shape does provide a second balancing pivot to toy with. If the goal is to have a really powerful module that's difficult to exploit, play with the shape.

[SirRichie]

Do not forget, however, that there is a different cost attached to the individual modules.
Sure, you will not mass produce them, so the actual total converted cost is of secondary importance. But the necessary items can control the required tech level.
Personally, I am perfectly ok with higher-level items to outperform lower-level ones. That feels like progress and achievement.