[0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
[0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Hello.
In 0.18.35 when you attack their nests, biters will first gather in large swarms and then launch a full scale attack. Currently in 0.18.36 biters will all just start going directly, individually, forming lines. The game is significantly easier that way, because they don't overwhelm your defenses.
Maybe something related to the AI change so they don't ignore you when you pass by the swarms inside a vehicle?
Steps to reproduce:
- Start a new game in sandbox
- Go to a far place where biters nests are huge so the effect is more pronouced
- Put an artillery cannon and start attacking the nests.
- Observe biters' behavior when launching the attack
Expected behavior, observed up to 0.18.35: biters launch a counter attack in large swarms.
Behavior @0.18.36: biters start going individually to counter attack.
I recorded a video that makes it very obvious.
Here @0.18.35: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9bj2EUaeu8
And here @0.18.36: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1_WYhMHNF8
In 0.18.35 when you attack their nests, biters will first gather in large swarms and then launch a full scale attack. Currently in 0.18.36 biters will all just start going directly, individually, forming lines. The game is significantly easier that way, because they don't overwhelm your defenses.
Maybe something related to the AI change so they don't ignore you when you pass by the swarms inside a vehicle?
Steps to reproduce:
- Start a new game in sandbox
- Go to a far place where biters nests are huge so the effect is more pronouced
- Put an artillery cannon and start attacking the nests.
- Observe biters' behavior when launching the attack
Expected behavior, observed up to 0.18.35: biters launch a counter attack in large swarms.
Behavior @0.18.36: biters start going individually to counter attack.
I recorded a video that makes it very obvious.
Here @0.18.35: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9bj2EUaeu8
And here @0.18.36: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1_WYhMHNF8
Last edited by dahhakd on Sat Jul 18, 2020 11:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: [0.18.36] Bitters not grouping before attacking
Post a link to your save please.
Re: [0.18.36] Bitters not grouping before attacking
I have edited the main post with a more comprehensive description and steps to reproduce.
Re: [0.18.36] Bitters not grouping before attacking
Please provide a save game, it is the most effective way of us testing the bug
Re: [0.18.36] Bitters not grouping before attacking
It is easy enough to reproduce with a new game, but here it goes. The save is at the exact moment and place, you just have to load and quickly zoom out to see the biters.
- Attachments
-
- biters-test.zip
- (4.15 MiB) Downloaded 137 times
Re: [0.18.36] Bitters not grouping before attacking
I checked it at 0.18.36 - yes, this is the behavior with the test map.
But that's not all - I loaded my map - everything is the same - after a shell hits the bitters nest, they run in slender columns without grouping towards the gun.
This is very bad behavior.
The previous one was no better when they are grouped in a huge flock and stand still. This, too, is still quite common for me, but I got used to this behavior, apparently it was intended that way.
Last edited by azesmbog on Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Here's a save exhibiting the problem: https://file.io/h2q0DLzUEOLY
The Pathfinder is running at 100ms, 300ms peak (on my hardware anyway)!!!!!! O_O
The Pathfinder is running at 100ms, 300ms peak (on my hardware anyway)!!!!!! O_O
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Updated URL (link expired?): https://file.io/TNJ3583lYlrKdarklich14 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:51 amHere's a save exhibiting the problem: https://file.io/h2q0DLzUEOLY
The Pathfinder is running at 100ms, 300ms peak (on my hardware anyway)!!!!!! O_O
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Every biter is asking for a path. Got an arty upgrade and hit 100ms pathfinder with 300ms peak. Server is a beast and running at 4 ups. It'll go back to 60 once all the auto range is cleared out. Please advise.
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
2 fps is no fun.
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Noticed the same change in attack behaviour when I was in sandbox mode testing out some new perimeter wall designs. I can provide a save file as well, but I think this video demonstrates the difference well.
https://youtu.be/yGvET2KhRKc
https://youtu.be/yGvET2KhRKc
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
The download links are both expired. But is this still happening in .37? I think it should be fixed already.
Edit: I have just been informed that we haven't released .37 yet, which might make it difficult for you to test. Anyway, I already fixed a bug like this that Klonan reported to me directly, so I think this will be fixed in .37.
Edit: I have just been informed that we haven't released .37 yet, which might make it difficult for you to test. Anyway, I already fixed a bug like this that Klonan reported to me directly, so I think this will be fixed in .37.
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
I had the exact same problem in .36, biters not merging into groups and being stuck pathfinding, nuking the UPS and increasing time spent pathfinding to 30+ UPS.
The issue seems to be entirely gone with .37, biters group up, attack properly, each group has a single pathfinding request, and any UPS drop from mass artillery aggro is from entity update rather than pathfinding. Tested on a couple saves I made that had the issue in .36 and it's gone in all of them.
The issue seems to be entirely gone with .37, biters group up, attack properly, each group has a single pathfinding request, and any UPS drop from mass artillery aggro is from entity update rather than pathfinding. Tested on a couple saves I made that had the issue in .36 and it's gone in all of them.
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
This does not seem to be fixed in .37:Oxyd wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:55 pmThe download links are both expired. But is this still happening in .37? I think it should be fixed already.
Edit: I have just been informed that we haven't released .37 yet, which might make it difficult for you to test. Anyway, I already fixed a bug like this that Klonan reported to me directly, so I think this will be fixed in .37.
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
My test save from .28 loaded into .37 still shows the non-grouping behaviour. The same save loaded in .35 behaves as expected. I haven't looked into it too deeply yet, but will report back if I can reproduce it with a fresh save on .37
-
- Long Handed Inserter
- Posts: 94
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:07 am
- Contact:
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
Try a birrage of manual artillery with the show-path-requests turned on. I get every single unit in a nest pathing separately, ups tanks, and pathfinder goes to 10+ms. I've seen it go to 100ms per tick on arty upgrades.Tomiz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 29, 2020 9:17 pmI had the exact same problem in .36, biters not merging into groups and being stuck pathfinding, nuking the UPS and increasing time spent pathfinding to 30+ UPS.
The issue seems to be entirely gone with .37, biters group up, attack properly, each group has a single pathfinding request, and any UPS drop from mass artillery aggro is from entity update rather than pathfinding. Tested on a couple saves I made that had the issue in .36 and it's gone in all of them.
Re: [0.18.36] Biters not grouping before attacking
In case people stumble on this older thread, a new one was started. Looks like they'll revert back to the previous behaviour for 0.18.39.
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=87297
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=87297