Factorio Forums

The contrast for circuit signal icons is very poor, in particular for cyan, white and grey circuit signals. Viewing them side by side may still be fine for many players, but seeing just a single one of them in the settings of a combinator may be too confusing.

I just came back from stopping Factorio in 0.17 just after the oil rework to 0.18 with the new icons landing the same week.

It took me a long time to find the "each" signal, partly because a mod added more signals above it, and partly because the new style made it look... not like a special, computer-only thing. Not sure how to explain that, but the rounded rectangle and the "bulge" in the middle fooled my eye for a while.

Thanks, I made the grey signal darker to fit better between white and black.

I've been thinking about the special each/anything/everything signals to be different than just yellow/green/red. I'll do something but I need some more time to think about it.

V453000 wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 02, 2020 3:46 pm

Thanks, I made the grey signal darker to fit better between white and black.

I've been thinking about the special each/anything/everything signals to be different than just yellow/green/red. I'll do something but I need some more time to think about it.

Easy answer: * / ∃ / ∀

riking wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:45 pm

Easy answer: * / ∃ / ∀

That is actually very reasonable suggestion.

I like that. Then it might be useful to rename also the description:

∃ - there exists (anything)
∀ - for all (everything)

The * For the “each” makes problems, because it’s different. First “each” it’s not a quantor, it’s an iteration. There is no mathematical symbol for “for each”. “*” seems to be wrong, because that’s convolution.
What I saw several times is something like ∀𝑖∈{2,…,𝑛} (for all elements in the set of 2, ...). So when we take the incorrectly shortened “∀∈“.
Would that make sense? In my opinion yes, but not sure: “for all elements (signals) do ...”. Which combines the ∀ with a new symbol, which means “this is similar to ∀ but does something with it.

If not, so I would recommend “⨯” (Times) Instead. Symbolizes multiplication and Cartesian product.

Hm, maybe there are others with better ideas.

And this is how all of them will stay * forever

* for 'each' is fine, as it is common wildcard symbol. Not consistent with logic symbols, but better than trying to shoe-horn mathematical symbol. I don't like × idea. If anything I'd prefer f or → or {}. But * seems as the best solution.

Lol your E and A are upside down...

That's what you will hear then everytime.

∃ - Anything
∀- Everything
Not good.

But I would really like to see some different marks.

coppercoil wrote: ↑

Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:09 pm

∃ - Anything
∀- Everything
Not good.

But I would really like to see some different marks.

As non mathematician that's how I'd view those symbols as well.

That's why I thought we need to rename them.

∃ - Exists (currently anything)
∀ - All (currently everything)

Examlpled forn Practice:

∃ > [5] translates to "Exist an item with count more than 5 ?"

∀ > [X] "All item-count is bigger than X"

Maybe a little too late to remame anything ...

Maybe just write:

Each/Any/All

instead of the stars (and keep the colors btw). I don’t think that would be to small to read. Localisation wouldn’t be more of a Problem than it is already. Either you understand enough English to read them, or you remember the colors, or you remember the words like symbols, or you have to hover over it for the localised description same as right now.

The upside down E and A would just confuse people imo. If you really want proper symbols I would opt for

* / X / #

ickputzdirwech wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:17 am

Maybe just write:

Each/Any/All

I would rather they avoid baking a specific localization into the icons. Not everyone plays on English.

coderpatsy wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:56 pm

ickputzdirwech wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:17 am

Maybe just write:

Each/Any/All

I would rather they avoid baking a specific localization into the icons. Not everyone plays on English.

It's already the case. Not everyone uses the same alphabet. But there is no way to localise the letter signals.